Author |
Message |
< 16ga. Ammunition & Reloading ~ Load recipes and Chronographs |
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:02 pm
|
|
|
Joined: 13 Oct 2015
Posts: 151
Location: SE Ks
|
|
I'm starting to wonder if I may of dropped down too much on a couple load recipes looking for a standard velocity.
Using the spreadsheets and the Hodgdon site I had settled on a couple of loads using 1 oz and 1 1/8 oz shot. When I chronographed them with a Competition Electronics ProChrono Chronograph, they came out faster than listed in my Dickinson Estate 16 gauge, 28" barrels. I ended up dropping the powder charges enough to align with the speed shown in the charts.
There's an all day rain here today and I'm bored to death. Got to wondering about the chronograph and those loads. I tested them on a cloudy, overcast day and didn't use the skyscreens. I decided to test a couple factory loads in between the rain showers.
Federal Game load 1 oz 6s, listed at 1165 fps came out at 1127
Remington Express Game Long Range 1 1/8 oz 6s listed at 1295 showed 1233
Now I'm wondering if I've dropped too far with my reloads. How close have you found factory loads to be to advertised speed on any you've tested?
My main concern was the 1 oz load and keeping it under the 1200 fps 8000psi level for my son's(cheesy) new/ 100 year old Oscar Will double. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:05 pm
|
|
|
Member
Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Posts: 9463
Location: Amarillo, Texas
|
|
They sound good to me
Remember elevation and barometric pressure, and all that jazz will affect FPS.
Now for the chrono, do you shoot a known 22 LR load across to insure calibration? I use same gun, same lot of ammo, and see what I can see.
Mike |
_________________
,
USAF RET 1971-95 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 2:31 pm
|
|
|
Joined: 13 Oct 2015
Posts: 151
Location: SE Ks
|
|
Just now tried the 22, drizzleing a bit, but didn't melt.
Remington 582 with 24" barrel.
CCI Green Tag Target ammo, listed at 1070fps gave 1015
Remington 22 Target, listed at 1150 gave 1107
Both boxes of ammo have been around several years.
If this rain clears out this week I'll put in a fresh battery and test the 22 in some sunshine. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 3:51 pm
|
|
|
Joined: 30 Sep 2015
Posts: 640
Location: NEW SALISBURY INDIANA
|
|
I suspected my loads were too hot, I use universal powder, and use the hodgdon load data, yep, they said it should be 1200 fps, but measured 1300 fps, called them up and they said no way, said my caldwell chrony was not good enough, so I measure some factory rem game loads. box said 1200 fps, I got 1205, 1212, 1207, so I cut back on the powder, now my shoulder no longer hurts after a couple of rounds of trap, less powder use and easier on my guns. I have rechecked my loads against factory several times and I get the same data from the factory loads. I am not impressed with Hodgdon people and their data, it seem they test a few loads then mathematically fill in the blanks. |
_________________ 16ga 3-Win 37
16ga Ithaca 37 1946
16ga Western Auto Revelation
16ga Browning A-5 1929
16ga Marlin 90 1939
16ga browning citori lightning grade 3 2003
16ga Francisque Darne 1920 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 6:06 pm
|
|
|
Joined: 24 Jun 2013
Posts: 2067
Location: canandaigua - western n.y. (formerly deerhunter)
|
|
talked to them (hodgdons)this past week about a 243 load - they found one ... asked them if any of their data was computer driven and the guy said emphatically NO ! |
_________________ Molly sez AArrrooooooah ! |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 7:06 pm
|
|
|
Joined: 30 Sep 2015
Posts: 640
Location: NEW SALISBURY INDIANA
|
|
look at their data for 16 ga 1 oz universal powder, and see how many 1165fps loads they list, its a bunch, kinda fishy |
_________________ 16ga 3-Win 37
16ga Ithaca 37 1946
16ga Western Auto Revelation
16ga Browning A-5 1929
16ga Marlin 90 1939
16ga browning citori lightning grade 3 2003
16ga Francisque Darne 1920 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:57 pm
|
|
|
Joined: 16 Jul 2015
Posts: 2126
Location: Hudson,Wy
|
|
If you dropped back on the load to get 1200 fps and it's shooting about 1200 fps, I would say you accomplished your task and should call it good. Accept a victory as just that, a victory. |
_________________ Only catch snowflakes on your tongue AFTER the birds fly south for the winter... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 8:16 am
|
|
|
Member
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
Posts: 1946
Location: Central CT
|
|
Many things mess with the readings you get from your skyscreen chronograph, including your reloading practices.
If it were me, I would never change a load from the readings I got off a skyscreen chronograph, unless (and I do) you have a load that you KNOW the velocity of. Off the shelf ammo can be plus or minus 90 FPS from what is printed on the box.
Chokes, lights or lighting, distance from the skyscreens can all affect the readings. If you have tight chokes in your shotgun, I can almost guarantee that the velocities will be higher.
The very best readings I have gotten from a skyscreen chronograph are arrived at by doing the following. This is derived from years (since 1993) of chronographing with Oehler 35P and Competition Electronics ProChrono.
Cylinder bore or .005" (skeet 1) chokes only. Anything tighter will skew the velocity reading upward.
The start screen 2' - 3' maximum from the muzzle.
Cloudy day(an absolute must) with diffusers over the skyscreens.
The aiming point is centered within the diffusers.
Use a known load as your reference. If you MUST use off the shelf ammo, buy actual premium target ammo. Correct your velocities to the known velocity of the reference. DO NOT throw out high and low velocities.
Here is another problem with the 16 gauge, there is no such thing as premium target ammo.
You have to remember that what you are using to check shotshell velocities, is not industry standard stuff. Nor do you have set standards for anything you do when it comes to reloading. Hodgdon and Alliant are not really going to listen to you because of this. Alliant does a better job of being nice, but they won't budge on their data either.....and I can't blame them. |
_________________ Mark |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:12 am
|
|
|
Joined: 24 Jun 2013
Posts: 2067
Location: canandaigua - western n.y. (formerly deerhunter)
|
|
Mark , any problem with using , say , a 12ga AA target load for your reference . then go ahead with your 16ga tests . |
_________________ Molly sez AArrrooooooah ! |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:25 am
|
|
|
Member
Joined: 08 Aug 2011
Posts: 1946
Location: Central CT
|
|
I am spoiled because I have always had reference loads for both 12 an 16 gauge lead target loads.
However I have never had a big discrepancy between switching shotguns/gauges.
Technically it is a bad idea. In reality you will probably be within 50 FPS.
The other items I failed to mention.
Crimp depths are a big deal. I have always tested at .062" or as close as I could get. Some folks are set on .055". Whatever works for you but I wouldn't vary the crimp depth any more or less than the two depths I mentioned.
Anytime you vary from the components in the data, no matter how minor, you have just added another variable that could scuttle your velocities. This is not the time to be, uh..........creative.
Don't expect perfection. Everything is averages and everyday things will vary a bit, even using the same exact loads, barrels instruments under lab conditions. If your reloads are within 50 FPS of the data, consider it a success, smile and move on.......unless of course you like self torture. If you have OCD tendencies or expect perfection you are going to be frustrated and disappointed. |
_________________ Mark |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:40 am
|
|
|
Joined: 16 Jul 2015
Posts: 2126
Location: Hudson,Wy
|
|
I was wondering if someone would mention crimp depth and its effect on velocity and pressure. I would worry about how well and consistently the shells pattern more than anything thing else. If they pattern great and the velocity is somewhere in the normal range, you have a winner. |
_________________ Only catch snowflakes on your tongue AFTER the birds fly south for the winter... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Posted:
Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:54 am
|
|
|
Joined: 09 Feb 2015
Posts: 822
|
|
kennedy756 wrote: |
I suspected my loads were too hot, I use universal powder, and use the hodgdon load data, yep, they said it should be 1200 fps, but measured 1300 fps, called them up and they said no way, said my caldwell chrony was not good enough, so I measure some factory rem game loads. box said 1200 fps, I got 1205, 1212, 1207, so I cut back on the powder, now my shoulder no longer hurts after a couple of rounds of trap, less powder use and easier on my guns. I have rechecked my loads against factory several times and I get the same data from the factory loads. I am not impressed with Hodgdon people and their data, it seem they test a few loads then mathematically fill in the blanks.
|
Must admit I could never use universal. If I used the purpose load also. Dang gun nearly jump out of my hands. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|