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< 16ga. General Discussion ~ Pup marking his territory - Inside my house |
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Posted:
Thu Oct 21, 2021 9:56 pm
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Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 209
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I have two Ryman English Setter pups - full brothers to the pup I lost at Christmas last year. Great dogs - birdy and boon companions to the family. Neither is neutered. The smaller of the two, Argo, is the full-on alpha male: bosses his larger brother in all facets of existence.
For about the last three weeks he’s taken to marking every point in the house. An interesting piece of trivia is that he only has one distended testicle. My wife and the vet are adamant that he be operated on - either to bring down the undistended testicle or castrate him altogether.
I’ve never had one of my males neutered. Maybe that’s the answer. Anybody else here have any ideas for getting him to stop marking his “territory” in my house? Short of going around and marking everything myself, I’m at a loss...
8mmFan[/list] |
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Posted:
Fri Oct 22, 2021 11:03 am
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Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 209
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Just kidding about the “marking my territory myself” part, of course....
8mmFan |
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Posted:
Fri Oct 22, 2021 12:47 pm
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Joined: 27 Jun 2012
Posts: 1115
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If he's anything like my three male shorthairs, he'd feel obligated to come mark over my mark anyway.
We all know that maturity will likely cure this marking along with a lot of other puppy faults, but have you tried putting him up in a crate with regular outdoor pee breaks? |
_________________ An elderly gentleman, his faithful dogs, and a 16 ga SXS. All is right with the world. |
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Posted:
Fri Oct 22, 2021 2:41 pm
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Member
Joined: 24 May 2012
Posts: 353
Location: United States
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He absolutely needs to be neutered. The remaining testicle is VERY likely to become cancerous, and will likely not be detected until the cancer is advanced. It is possible to only remove the undescended testicle but maybe hard to find a Veterinarian that would do the surgery for multiple reasons. I wouldn't do it but that is my personal opinion.
I tried to find some numbers on doing surgery to reposition the undescended testicle and what that did for cancer probability. I could not find any reliable numbers but if you look at human literature it depends on how old they are at this time of surgery. The younger the better but regardless cancer numbers are increased.
James Flinchbaugh DVM |
_________________ A fine gun is nice. A fine bird dog is essential. JTF
"My degree of optimism is negotiated daily" Bill Snyder, Former Head Football Coach, Kansas State University |
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Posted:
Fri Oct 22, 2021 7:22 pm
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Joined: 12 Sep 2010
Posts: 1975
Location: Maine
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8mmFan wrote: |
Just kidding about the “marking my territory myself” part, of course....
8mmFan
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It's been known to work. You just have to have enough confidence in the strength of the fence/chain between you and the dog, while you take care of the business. Not recommended for inside the house.
Done it outside once or twice. In each instance, it shut the barking off and left the dog slinking away whenever it saw me coming. Best done after several beers - the sheer volume will make clear to the canine this is REALLY your turf, sidewalk, town.
Still not recommended inside the house. |
_________________ “A man’s rights rest in three boxes: the ballot box, the jury box, and the cartridge box.”
Frederick Douglass, November 15, 1867, speech in Williamsport, Pa. |
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Posted:
Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:55 pm
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Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 209
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LOL - Dave and Riflemeister, thanks for the laughs... I wasn’t really serious about marking stuff myself (have done that, though, while deer hunting, when I’ve had to leave part of a deer out overnight after shooting it at sundown. Meant to keep the coyotes off of it. Seems like it works).
i don’t have a problem with the pup marking his territory outside, just in the house.
Sounds like this might just be a “phase,” but I can’t remember my previous dogs doing it. I thought it might have something to do with having two intact pups in the house.
James, thanks for the veterinary advice. Our vet told us much the same early on (the pup is about 10 months old). Advised to not wait much past a year. She did say that they have had success in bringing them down, but we didn’t ask if there was still a large chance of cancer from it down the road if that’s successful.
I guess I’ve always been averse to neutering my dogs, in the (maybe misguided) belief that an intact dog is a little more impervious to elemental discomfort and has a little more drive over time in tough conditions. I may be overblowing that line of thought.
At any rate, this pup is in all likelihood going to be neutered. |
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Posted:
Mon Mar 28, 2022 3:46 pm
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Joined: 24 May 2012
Posts: 353
Location: United States
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Just thought I would check in and see what you decided with your pup. I hope all is going well
James |
_________________ A fine gun is nice. A fine bird dog is essential. JTF
"My degree of optimism is negotiated daily" Bill Snyder, Former Head Football Coach, Kansas State University |
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Posted:
Thu Apr 14, 2022 9:41 pm
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Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 209
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Hi James,
Thanks for asking. We went ahead and had him neutered. The vet that did the surgery did not feel that he could successfully operate to have the testicle brought down. So the pup lost both testicles.
It's been about four months. He has stopped "marking" in the house (his intact brother continued with the habit until just about two weeks ago--seems to have stopped, for the most part. We did have some "go-arounds" over it). The neutering absolutely had an effect on the pup's personality. Although he's still the "alpha male" of the two, he seems to be more timid than he was before the surgery. He also seems to be a lot "needier." I remain biased against neutering a male bird dog. We'll see how it ultimately plays out in the field.
8mmFam |
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Posted:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 5:07 pm
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Joined: 07 Sep 2011
Posts: 572
Location: wheeling, wv
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Neutering will not stop his marking. My wifes little house dog was neutered as a pup, and he is the markingest dog ever. We had trouble with him in the house for years--he seems to be over it now at age 12. |
_________________ we salute you bird of thunder |
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Posted:
Fri Apr 15, 2022 11:20 pm
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Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 452
Location: WI
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Having had waaaay too many dogs in the house, and having owned a few dogs over the years, there is no medical reason to neuter a male dog, except health reasons. I neutered a dog that developed a cyst of a testicle that was not cancerous but could become so, and another that did have a rare form of testicular cancer that was resolved by neutering. All my other males have remained intact Neutering a male dog will not stop it from marking. Crate training and age does that. |
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Posted:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:58 am
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Joined: 10 Apr 2013
Posts: 120
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This seems to reinforce my preference for spayed females. |
_________________ Nasty-G |
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Posted:
Thu Apr 21, 2022 9:23 am
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Joined: 21 May 2015
Posts: 128
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First, marking is a learned behaviour... once it starts, neutering will only make you feel better... it will not stop the "habit".
I had a Ryman-Hemlock male... most difficult dog I ever had to house break. I think he was reliable when we buried him at 12 yo.
Personally, the only "cure" now is crating when not supervised. And, supervision means not letting them out of your sight...
Good luck, |
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Posted:
Tue Apr 26, 2022 5:05 am
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Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 209
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These are both Ryman setters, as was their older brother. All three have had issues with it, although the older brother didn’t live long enough to really know for sure whether he’d outgrow it.
The neutered pup has stopped marking in the house; the other pup still has issues with it, but, it goes in streaks (no pun intended)—he’ll stop for a week and a half, and then a flurry for a day or two until he and I have a real heart-to-heart when I catch him.
All three pups have been absolute boon companions as I’ve said. Terrific personalities, conformationally sound (except for the one undistended testicle), loving, and very intelligent. Wonderful dogs, and I’d recommend them wholeheartedly. But hard-headed as hell on this one issue, and unless you like your house smelling like a vet’s office (which I don’t) get ready for a period of trial. I can’t see buying them to kennel them, either: too enjoyable of a personality not to have them with you in the house.
8mmFan |
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Posted:
Tue Apr 26, 2022 3:43 pm
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Member
Joined: 24 May 2012
Posts: 353
Location: United States
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No offense taken but there is no urine smell in my hospital . |
_________________ A fine gun is nice. A fine bird dog is essential. JTF
"My degree of optimism is negotiated daily" Bill Snyder, Former Head Football Coach, Kansas State University |
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Posted:
Tue Apr 26, 2022 6:07 pm
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Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 209
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You're right, eng-pointer: I shouldn't be slinging rocks at vet hospitals when my own walls are made of glass!
8mmFan |
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