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<  16ga. General Discussion  ~  1939 M37 value?
Lloyd3
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2022 4:01 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Savage16: Appreciate that. I found them both, matching thankfully.

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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2022 7:33 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Another question: what does "hand-chased" engraving on these guns look like? The engraving on the side-panels on this 1939 gun looks better to me than the later (post-war) stuff, but they still seem to be roll-stamped?

[url=https://imgur.com/IrW0ng0] [/url]

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Cold Iron
PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2022 4:34 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 09 Mar 2016
Posts: 746
Location: Mn.

The first set of plates used didn't cut enough relief in the metal so Ithaca had engravers "chase" the light cuts by hand. That went on up until 39 when they replaced the plates. From the looks of yours when enlarged it does appear to be hand cut. Hard to tell from here but hand cut is deeper and sharper. Sometimes they took liberty with their job and added additional detail, that is a dead giveaway. But for the most part they just cut deeper into what the plate did.
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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 10:42 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Cold Iron: Thank you for that. I am told first year for the 16 was 1938, so this being a 2nd year gun, some hand work might still have been going on.

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Waylon1979
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 11:53 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 26 Feb 2018
Posts: 27
Location: Ohio

Could u post a hood up close pic of the other side of the receiver? I have a 41 Model that has hand chased engraving.
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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 12:08 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Sure...

[url=https://imgur.com/P1mHWav] [/url]

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Ohio Wirehair
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 1:30 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 24 Jul 2016
Posts: 546
Location: Ohio

That's a very nice 37. Did you ever consider putting a left hand safety in it? Saving the old one of course. Wink
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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 2:38 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

OW: Yes, I did (sort-of). I had tried that with an early 20-bore M12 and didn't find it to help all that much. In the end it became clear that a SXS was the best answer for me.

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Ted Schefelbein
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 4:07 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Posts: 1480
Location: Mpls, MN.

The model 12 safety is in the wrong spot, Lloyd. The lefty safety is better in the model 37.
The Williams big button safety, either right or left handed, seems to improve a model 12, but, that is just my opinion.

Best,
Ted

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Swampy16
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 4:36 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Oct 2019
Posts: 453
Location: New Jersey

Lloyd3 wrote:
If you look at the previous picture attached to my post, you'll see my pre-war M37 next to a M31L, followed by a somewhat-modified M12. These were the only three 16-guage pump guns (at least to my knowledge) ever built to a proper-weight for the gauge. I did the same thing with 3 or 4 20-gauge pump guns as well (because after 12-plus years working in a fine-gun shop, I wanted to see if a fellow could acquire a truly- great bird gun w/o spending all that money for a decent double). If I had been right-eye dominant and accordingly right-handed I believe that I would have succeeded. Between the pre-war M37 and the possibly-rarer post-war M31L, I'm now convinced that the average Joe could indeed do exactly that. Both guns were and are truly magnificent bird guns but...I'd probably give the nod to the pre-war Ithaca in terms of build-quality and maybe balance (which I know is very subjective).

In the 20-gauge pumpers, while I have immense-respect (& strong nostalgia) for the early M12s, the Remington M17 really won me over as well (John Browning really knew what he was doing, eh?). The only gun I never was able to secure was a Stevens M520-30 (yet another Browning design) in the also very-briefly produced flattop-version to try alongside the rest, which was a darn shame because the much earlier-version (the double-hump gun) in 20 was pretty impressive as well.

My 20s (w/o my circa 1913 M12)...
[url=https://imgur.com/FwWL1Y2] [/url]
Darn fun research, if nothing else.

Well anyway... long live the ubiquitous American pump-gun! But...as a true Southpaw (w/both left-eye & hand dominance), I pretty-much have to use a properly-fitted double to find that rather-exacting combination of all the subtle (little & big) things needed to allow me to properly chase ruffed grouse (with any hope of regular success).

What is the weight of your Steven’s pump?
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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 4:43 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Don't own the little Stevens 520 anymore (it was actually a Westernfield Model 30), but it was a true 6 pounder...

[url=https://imgur.com/cYvuSj4] [/url]

Shockingly decent little gun with a neat take-down design. I just couldn't get comfortable with that "suicide" safety.

[url=https://imgur.com/H9JDqRQ] [/url]

Probably the best ambidextrous pumpgun I ran across in my little quest was this last iteration of the 520 (from the 1940s). That top tang safety really works well for me. This one's a 12, the 20-gauge versions are very hard to find (I never did).

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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2022 6:10 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Ted: I love the Williams "Big Head" safety and on an M12 it works just fine for me, even on a right-handed set up. There's no confusing where "go" is, ever.

[url=https://imgur.com/yl5sruX] [/url]

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Lloyd3
PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2022 10:39 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 17 Jan 2014
Posts: 1365
Location: Denver, Colorado

Another gun I got to try out in 20-gauge was the Stevens 620, which in profile looks surprisingly much-like a Model 12. A lot heavier than the sub-gauge 520, it was never in the running in my estimation. Well-made but a bit ungainly, a model 12 works better (at least for me).

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