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Joined: 16 Jan 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Michigan, USA

I have a A5 Sweet Sixteen 26" barrel with a fixed choke of IC......
I have measured my barrel end at .646.... Tighter than IC
but I have not measured the bore..... so that is the missed number.

So with that said.... What is the effective range of an IC barrel... with lead
and what would it be with Non-Toxic....

oh... buy the way does anyone know the tolerance of the 16 ga bore +/-?

I am using standard bore dia of .662.

Thanks...

what you shooting it at? Ducks with steel, will be less than ducks with nonconforming lead, or heay or biz.
Over a pointer, longer preceived, than over a flusher
My uneducated guess, is it's the same as a 12, or 28, Only difference is payload. a #5 shot is going to travel the same distance when propeled by the same charge. The more shot, the tighter (more filled in )pattern at a give distance. At least thats my non techy belief

and 35-45 yards, unless your TJC, then it's 100yards, or however the shot is to poach my birds, and failing that he makes the shot and the bird is mine, he'll send his pits in to "claim" the kill.

Member Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: Michigan

sumpin like dat.

You going to be around? Haven't listend to your vm.

Joined: 16 Jan 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Michigan, USA

I will be shooting pheasants over a young pointer.......

One thing I will recommend is to go to a range/field/whatever and work targets at progressively longer ranges to understand how far you can hit & break them.

Once you know how far you can consistently hit with the gun, you can determine if you can kill with which ever load you are using.

Blackice, I can't give you a max range, but it shouldn't be any kind of a issue over a pointer. What I can tell you (like we had to beat into sprocket) let'm get out a bit further Wink

rther.

Member Joined: 18 Nov 2005 Posts: 398 Location: S Fl

I have 3 Sweets in my records. Here are the year of mfr followed by bore size.

1954---.662
1956---.660
1958---.665

The first was marked Mod and had choke of 023.
The other 2 were IC and choked 009 and 014 respectively.

So, without the bore dimension, you don't know squat.

Sorry,
Pete

The first thing to find the effective range is to pattern the gun Try different shells. Different shells, different patterns. You're shooting over a young pointer, how steady is he? I know that with a 16 gauge A-5 standard with winchester #4's, I have hit a pheasant at 40 yards with the polychoke sae at I/C. I do not have any A-5's anymore as I sold all six of them. Strictly O/U and SxS now. I did knock down a chukar over my pup this weekend at about 30 yards with #6 federals choked at I/C. Pattern the gun and know what you are shooting. I forgot to say what gun I was using. Remington SPR 16 gauge O/U. For the money, one of the nicest shooting guns I've owned.

17mm is the standard European 16 ga bore size. Somewhere on your barrel, the bore size is given in millimeters. Divide that number by 25.4 (millimeters per inch) and you will have a close approximation of your actual bore size. Subtract your choke diameter from the bore size to get the points in thousandths.

Improved Cylinder (.007-.010) can be effective to a maximum of 35-40 yards with 1-1/8 ounce loads and premium #5 shot for pheasant. Modified (.012-.017) will add another 3-5 yards depending on the load again. One ounce loads will shorten your range by about 15 percent across the board.

Faster loads hit a bit harder, but spread quicker. Target speed loads of 1150 to 1250 FPS will hold a tighter pattern longer if they are loaded with premium shot. Using a bit bigger shot size will compensate for the lower velocity.

A 1-1/8 ounce, 1250 FPS load of hard premium #5 shot can be an outstanding load for pheasant if you are limited to one choke size. Even improved cylinder choked barrels seem to shoot this load well out to about 40 yards with deadly effect. The bigger harder pellets deform less, pattern well out of any 12 ga and most 16 ga guns. #5 shot also penetrates very well on pheasant sized birds. It's the go to load for many savvy pheasant hunters.

#5 shot is too big for most 20 ga guns to shoot well. That is why a 16 can and does outperform a 20 on bigger birds like pheasant, and its why many dedicated midwest pheasant hunters will opt for a 16 if they don't take the 12. They depend on #5 premium shot to bring those roosters down dead. It does. The 16 ga will give up very little to the 12 if loaded with a good balanced load of #5 shot in my experience.

Soft shot will limit your range by at least 20 percent, regardless of choke. Soft shot and tighter chokes do not mix at all, so using a full choke to compensate for cheap promo ammo does not work. You would be better off using a more open choke and keep your ranges to under 35 yards. The open choke will deform the softer pellets less and your patterns will be less patchy.

Soft shot also does not penerate as well as hard shot, so use one shot size bigger here like #5 instead of #6 shot on pheasant size birds. The problem here is that #5 shot in not often found in promo loads, so you probably will be using #6 shot anyway if you are shooting promo loads. Remember this and don't shoot at a pheasant sized bird much past 30 yards with soft #6 shot or you'll be chasing a lot of cripples. It wastes time, and you'll look like a dude to anyone who is a competant hunter.

Nobody wants to be repeatedly helping his partner to find the running cripples all morning. We do it because its the right thing to do, but we probably won't be hunting with that guy again, and we probably will not complain or say why either. Clean kills are the right way to do it for a number of good reasons. (This is "Dutch Uncle" advise. Wink

)

Pattern your gun with any load you choose to really get the true picture of what your range will be. Then there is the accuracy factor. A practiced shot can hit further out with less choke and can use the added range of a tighter choke more effectively than a sport who only practices just before the season for one or two rounds of skeet or trap if at all. It always comes down to the indian and not the arrow.

Guest

I see some post re. pheasants (esp. from areas where wild pheasants don't live) provide their information on this topic. You mentioned pheasants in Michigan. Are you shooting wild or preserve birds?? Compared to preserve birds, the wild birds are significantly harder to bag since they won't hold well for a pointing dog; when they do flush, it's a little further out; they fly faster, hence easier to put your shot in the wrong spot; and if you hit them but they're wounded, are tough to find them since they run so well. An I/C choke is the same in the A5 as in any other 16 gauge if you're basing your "choke" on pattern distribution at a given range. To finally your question, I wouldn't have any problem taking a shot at a wild pheasant within 35 yards given I'm shooting quality ammo and I have a good angle at the front part of the birds to ensure hitting the vital areas. For preserve birds, you can add several more yards to that estimate. They'll be someone on this posting bragging of their 50+ yard shot with their I/C. But to shoot wild birds consistently, I like to follow these yardage guidelines. There is nothing worse than crippling a bird by taking a marginal shot. That's why a lot of upland game hunters like a double just because you have a I/C and improved modified option.....
Good luck

Joined: 16 Jan 2006 Posts: 8 Location: Michigan, USA

FYI....

Took my 16ga into my gunsmith.... miked the barrel and stated the it is a Improved Modified...... Browning marking indicate Improved Cylinder (**_)

He also went on to say that when gun was made shell were made with paper wads and with the new plastic wads changes the shot column.

But my thought is this... Isn't choke constriction a mathematical calculation vs the bore dia?

Member Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 138 Location: Parma, OH

Yup, choke is constriction minus bore diameter.....someone may have screwed up at the factory when they were playing with the choke marking machine... Smile

Mike Doerner

Either that or the gunsmith misread the mike. At any rate, a few shots at a couple or three large enough pieces of paper like news print from 35 yards should tell the story. Be sure to use a decent load with good hard shot to get a good idea of what the gun will do.

There is not a big difference between Imp. mod and full, especially with bigger shot pellets. If the barrel proves to be I. mod, spreader loads will make close in work a lot easier without pureeing the birds. I've had exceptional results with the 16 ga. polywad spreader inserts over 1 ounce of hard #6 shot at 1290 FPS out to 30 yards. At this range, the spread is perfect and the #6 hard shot is penetrates well enough to kill any average rooster under normal conditions.

Premium #5 shot will pattern very well out at 40 to 45 yards from an I mod choke. I'd say a very good wing shot could use such a barrel effectively out at 50 yards max with an excellently tailered load of hard #5 shot. However, the average shot is better off restricting himself to 40.