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Joined: 28 Mar 2008 Posts: 1460 Location: Eagle, Nebraska

I have used BPI loads for years. I do not have a chronograph so I cannot attest to accuracy of velocity of the loads. And to be honest, if loads are faster than advertised, GREAT, that is a bonus. Pressuer bothers me some as some of the loads I use out of the manual are for the short hulls, and if using them out of the old parker, I don't want to run into trouble.

I think with my hunting loads, I am ok, pressure not that great and according to Hammack, backing down from 1 oz to 7/8oz should reduce pressure and the wear on the old girl.

Anyone selectively test any of the BPI loads??

Guest

Yes.

Call BPI and ask what lab has tested their data.

If you can find out, you will be the only person I know that could get that information.

Joined: 28 Mar 2008 Posts: 1460 Location: Eagle, Nebraska

By that comment, and I have read it before, I take it that BPI doesn't actually test, but calculates what velocity should be???

Guest

Not sure how they do it, but their loads have been known to be well over pressure, and that is more important than the velocity. I know that a lot of folks on this site are looking for lower pressure loads. I would hate for a guy to ruin a nice old gun and possibly get hurt because he used bad data.

Joined: 23 Jan 2008 Posts: 224

Hootch,

Yes, I have tested a BPI load. Here is the results:

The load I tested was load 16201L114-08 on page 33 of "The 16 gauge manual, 4th edition." (It is very similar to load M1605324 on page 9 of the 5th edition of the manual.)

The BPI published load calls for" Cheddite hull (2 3/4), Fiocchi-616, 25 gr, Longshot, 2 OB-16 gas seal, a 1/8" NC16 card wad, a teflon wrap, 1 1/4 oz lead shot, and "original" buffer. The load lists 10,600 psi and 1,310 fps.

I made this load and had it tested by Tom Armbrust. To be fair...I made the following modifications to the load:

1) I used a cheddite 209 instead of the Fiocchi-616 (because that is what comes in the new hulls).

2) I used "Mix-47" buffer instead of "original" buffer (because that is what I had, and there isn't much difference between the two.)

3) I used 1 1/8 oz lead shot instead of 1 1/4 oz lead shot.

Based on using less lead in the shell, I expected to get a pressure less than the 10,600 psi listed. That was NOT the case.

My results from Tom Armbrust's tests: Ave velocity: 1365 fps (sd 11, ev 23) Pressure: 14733 psi (ev 1900)

I will admit the load I tested is not "exactly" as published. But, I was going conservative with the load. If I had used the actuall 1 1/4 oz called for, I'm guessing pressure would be somewhere between 17000 to 19000 psi.

Guest

I don't trust their data either. Like I mentioned in another post recently, the one load I tried from those boys (followed to a T) chronographed 100 fps faster than they claimed. I'm sure the pressure was also significantly higher, too!

After that experience I really looked over their data, comparing their "16 Gauge Manual" to the "Reloading for Shotgunners's 4th Ed." and became even less comfortable with what I was seeing. "Linear Estimation" must be the name of their testing lab.

It's funny you say that Dave, I just recently started taking a look at Hodgdon's and Alliant's data compared to BPI's and excepting the loads in BPI's data that are the same as the other two (I'm guessing that they just copied them from the free load guides and claimed as their own), I'm coming to the same linear estimation conclusions that you already have.

Joined: 28 Mar 2008 Posts: 1460 Location: Eagle, Nebraska

I think I am going to load up some of my "favorites" from BPI data and send them into Tom this spring. See where they are at.

Not to concerned with short loads, getting some off of Low Pressure group sheet.

Joined: 28 Mar 2008 Posts: 1460 Location: Eagle, Nebraska

Fiocchi hull, z-16 wad, 32gr of Longshot 1 oz=1300fps + 10400psi

Same for Multi-hull with win 209 primer.

Cheddite w/31gr Longshot 1oz= 1330 + 10500

Now in the Prairie Pheasant Manual:

Fiocchi z-16 1 oz 30gr Longshot+1400fps+10500psi

Multi-hull z-16 1 oz 28 gr Longshot=1500fps+10500

I am a little confused now. Look @ Fiocchi hulls, two more grains of poweder in same load produces 1,000fps LESS velocity??

In the Multi-hull using 4 less grains of Longshot increases velocity 2,000fps!!

I am going to load up the multi-hull, cheddite and Fiocchi loads and send them to Tom A. Lets see what the real story is.

ANybody have thoughts ??

I've been loading cut down Federals with 1 oz., 21.5 g Longshot with the z16 wad with great results. The lp group lists a similar load with 19g LS at only 5300 psi. and 1100 fps +/-. 21.5g is a soft shooting load with decent velocity, but I might bump it up to 23g for hunting purposes. 30g Longshot is a lot of powder, but any less in a Fiocchi hull would probably require a filler.

Joined: 23 Jan 2008 Posts: 224

Guest

Hootch,

Now you will find out the real truth about who has loads properly tested and who is full of B.S.

Hootch, more powder yielding less speed is not unheard of. I see the same thing sometimes when working up bottleneck metallic rifle loads. You pass the point of greatest cartridge efficiency and adding more powder yields nothing or even less fps.

It could also be a misprint when the data was developed and not caught by a proofreader.