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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:34 pm  Reply with quote
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I did a web search to find out what the new 16 ga Ithaca model 37 guns are like. Found out they are listed at 7.4 pounds. The 12 ga models are listed at 7.6 pounds. Not much difference in weight from what I can see.

So does this mean the new manufacturer is using a 12 ga sized frame on these 16 ga guns now? I really hope it's not so. Any accurate info here would be appreciated.
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Jagdhund
PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:50 pm  Reply with quote
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I emailed Ithaca with that very question. I haven't heard back yet. I would like to see one of the current iteration of the M37 in the flesh. Nobody stocks them in our area and I suppose they are not numerous enough to show up on the used gun racks yet.

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Gil S
PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:48 pm  Reply with quote
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You will get a quicker response calling 1.877.648.4222; ask to speak with Zak. He's the customer service rep. I've bought directly from Ithaca the 28 gauge and the 20 gauge TurkeySlayer. Both M37s are on gauge appropriate frames.
No polymer used or shortcuts taken in making these guns.
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Jagdhund
PostPosted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:17 pm  Reply with quote
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I received an email response today from Ithaca. Their response time was Impressive, but the reply sucked. "All Ithaca M37s are made on a standard frame, except the 28 gauge."

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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:43 am  Reply with quote
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Does it ever. This means we now have no new US made 16 ga repeaters made on a small frame--not one.

IMO, it's a good thing Browning had the foresight to listen to us 16 ga folks and make the 16 ga BPS on a modified 20 ga frame. Thankfully, it is also very well made if mine is any indication.

Once again, thank you Browning for taking care of us. Much appreciated.
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Gil S
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:21 am  Reply with quote
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First measurement with dial calipers taking care not to scratch guns, is top to bottom of receiver behind barrel and mag. tube. Second measurement is thickness. I re-weighed guns on a newer digital scale than what I have used before.
Below are, left to right, 1949 M37R 16 2.3", 1.310" 6.5 lbs.
1959 M37 16 2.3", 1.35 6.25 lbs.
2011 M37 28 2.225", 1.29" 6 lbs.
2011 M37 20 2.3", 1.37 7lbs, 3 oz.
I no longer have my 12 gauge M37s. Perhaps someone can measure one. The new 20 is the same frame, more or less than the 50-60 year old 16s.
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southpaw02
PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 2:48 pm  Reply with quote
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gg,

Not trying to offend or start anything. Have you checked the weight on a BPS in 16ga? A 16 hunter model is 7 lbs 2 oz. The upland special is 6lbs 13oz.. 2 to 8 ounces. IMO this is a non issue.
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Grousen
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 8:32 am  Reply with quote
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I have bought the Ohio made M37 in all four gauges, 12, 16, 20 & 28. The receiver size was specific (standard) for each gauge, and each gauge frame size was different from the other gauges.

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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:03 am  Reply with quote
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southpaw02 wrote:
gg,

Not trying to offend or start anything. Have you checked the weight on a BPS in 16ga? A 16 hunter model is 7 lbs 2 oz. The upland special is 6lbs 13oz.. 2 to 8 ounces. IMO this is a non issue.


No offense taken southpaw. I own one of the first BPS 16 ga Upland models and weighed it on a certified concrete lab scale when I first got it. It is a 26" model and weighs in at 6 pounds, 14 ounces. That's about 6.9 pounds. It is well balanced, quick to the shoulder, and easy to shuck. I also own a 1969 16 ga, 28" barrel Model 37 built on the same frame as the 20 ga model of that era. It weighs in at 6 pounds, 15 ounces and a tad. I love it. It is also well balanced and very quick to the shoulder. It also shucks like it has well greased ball bearings in the races.

I also own a couple of 12 gauge guns which weigh in at about 7.4 pounds. They are well balanced and quick to the shoulder as well, though not as greasy quick as the BPS or the 37. They also get heavier faster over a long day. Still managable, but it's noticable. However, the 12 ga guns hit the birds harder at longer ranges due to the better ballistics they inherently have. I want the extra potential power if I must also carry the extra weight.

I simply have a hard time believing the new 16 ga Model 37s weigh in at 7.4 pounds if they are also built on the smaller frames. However, Grousen has stated he owns one, and it is built on the smaller frame. Perhaps he can weigh it for us and report back with some facts. I'd really appreciate it. I think quite a few of us would. Thanks in advance Grousen.


Last edited by 16gaugeguy on Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Jagdhund
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:51 am  Reply with quote
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Jagdhund wrote:
I received an email response today from Ithaca. Their response time was Impressive, but the reply sucked. "All Ithaca M37s are made on a standard frame, except the 28 gauge."


Perhaps they meant "standard frame by gauge".

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Grousen
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:25 am  Reply with quote
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My Ohio made 16 gauge M37 was one of only four made. It weighed 6.2 pounds. Visually it looked almost the same as the 20 gauge frame. I'm not the mechanical type, don't have accurate measuring tools, thus didn't measure it.

If you are looking for the actual dimensions of the 4 gauges, you might try calling Zak at the Ithaca plant. You will find him most helpful.

Regards,
Grousen

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Gil S
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:27 pm  Reply with quote
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Grousen,
I see you are an M37 fan. How has the 28 performed? I had to send mine back for repair. It seems fine now. Gil
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16gaugeguy
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:47 pm  Reply with quote
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Thanks for the info Grousen. However,"only four made" means these last 16 gauge 37 models are spread pretty thin. I got the same answer BTW. "Made on a standard frame." So I guess we have seen the closing of an era for U.S. made 16 ga pumps here.

Glad I own my 1969 model. We probably won't see it's like again. What a shame. Anyway, enjoy yours. I'd hang on to it with both hands if I were you.
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Ted Schefelbein
PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 5:37 pm  Reply with quote



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He is talking about an Ultra-Sandusky only made 4 of them, in 16 gauge. The regular Ohio 16 gauge is on it's own size receiver, as noted (and, ignored) by the OP.
If you mean by "We probably won't see it's like again" that plastic white line spacers and impressed checkering aren't coming back any time soon, I think that part is OK. Depending on wood density, some of the 1940s-1950s Ithaca 37 steel receiver guns will rival the Ultras for light weight, especially the guns with plain barrels. The earlier ring tail front wood is slimmer than the semi-beaver tail monstrosity thing that came later, also.
Been there, bought the T shirt, mailed the post card, done that.


Best,
Ted

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Gil S
PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:04 am  Reply with quote
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16gaugeguy wrote:
So I guess we have seen the closing of an era for U.S. made 16 ga pumps here.


You've guessed wrong. Other than by Ithaca Gun Co., no other 16 gauge pump is currently made in the US. Unless my eyes and dial calipers are lying to me, the currently made 20 gauge frame is the same size as a 1949 and 1959 M37s in 16 gauge.
On another forum, this issue has come up. The 16 and 20 are the same frame size externally. A member measured 2 1975 12 gauges. The frames sizes were:
height measurement is 2.422 and 2.435, thickness is 1.335 and 1.330 Give the new Ithaca Company credit for making a 16 gauge in the US; Browning can't say the same.
As for having a hard time believing the frames are different because of the reported heavier weights, I was told that the barrel on my 20 gauge was thicker than the old 20. Whether that holds for the new 16 gauge, I don't know because I haven't measured or weighed one.
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