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tda003
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 7:53 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Apr 2017
Posts: 60
Location: St. Simons Island, GA

I'm trying to compare Polywad Vintager 16 gauge vs. RST Falcon. In 2 1/2" shells. Both are loaded with 7/8 oz. of shot. Polywad states it uses 2 1/4 dram equivalent. RST uses a 1125 fps measurement. I'll be using the shells in my vintage William Ford 16 gauge box lock. I've been told by the seller that the RST Falcon shells will be safe in it. Will the Polywad also be safe. I'd rather not just experiment, but would like to see which the gun likes more.

Also, just for the heck of it, I'd like to try my hand at reloading and so will want to know which powder, shells and primers to use. My ignorance in these matters is legion as I've just purchased shells for my newer shotguns without much thought about it.

Thanks for any help.

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Savage16
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 2:58 pm  Reply with quote
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I think if you call the companies they will b happy to give you the pressure and velocity figures. They are really helpful. Good luck

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Cheyenne08
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 3:33 pm  Reply with quote
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RST will be happy to quote the pressures of their shells, I compared RST and Polywad a couple of years ago, and RST had by far the lowest pressure.

I have not checked Polywad recently, being so satisfied with the RST loads.

Both are good companies, I happen to prefer RST.

Dale

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Hootch
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 4:29 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 28 Mar 2008
Posts: 1460
Location: Eagle, Nebraska

USed both in vintage 1919 Parker Trojan, even the 1oz spreader loads, no issues. Have loaded my own, used Longshot (and a load with Universal) 1 oz loads at 1300+fps, don't remember pressure.

I know the old parker is well built, built better than today's guns for sure.
Have never worried about it.

Used it a lot last year as it was the "year of the 16", lots of B&P loads through and they are faster than Polywad or RST.
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tda003
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 5:52 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Apr 2017
Posts: 60
Location: St. Simons Island, GA

Thanks very much. I expect the Wm. Ford will take either, but I just don't want to find out the hard way that I'm wrong.

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67galaxie
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 8:05 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 16 Mar 2017
Posts: 226
Location: Valdosta GA

Call Polywad. They are great on the phone and will answer anything you have to ask. Shipping is quick and cheap since they are in Georgia with us. I love both companies
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Dogchaser37
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 11:14 am  Reply with quote
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Here is a question for you......if your shotgun is safe at 7,000 PSI but not at 10,000 PSI, are you really going to put your face on the stock and pull the trigger?

I am not making jokes or being condescending.

If one brand of shell is safe in your shotgun, both brands are safe, if one brand isn't safe, than neither are safe.

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tda003
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 1:48 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Apr 2017
Posts: 60
Location: St. Simons Island, GA

I assume that means that the ballistics are the same for both brands 0f 16 gauge shells. Thanks for clarifying that. What are they then?

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Cheyenne08
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 3:37 pm  Reply with quote
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tda003 wrote:
I assume that means that the ballistics are the same for both brands 0f 16 gauge shells. Thanks for clarifying that. What are they then?


Basically, you have to determine what load YOU want to shoot. Then YOU call both RST and Polywad and ask them your questions.

We can't read your mind to determine what load is best for YOU, you have to take this responsibility on yourself.

Both are good outfits you have to make up your own mind on which you would like to purchase.

Have fun!

Dale

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tda003
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 4:14 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Apr 2017
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Location: St. Simons Island, GA

Got it. Thanks.

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Dogchaser37
PostPosted: Wed May 17, 2017 2:21 pm  Reply with quote
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Your shotgun should have proof marks on it, from what little I know about William Ford, it seems they produced excellent stuff. The proof marks will tell you what ammo you need to use in it.

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tda003
PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 1:34 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Apr 2017
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Location: St. Simons Island, GA

My shotgun is currently at Dan Rossiter's for a barrel re-blue. A friend scratched it in a couple of places and wanted to have it re-blued. At first I thought against it, but a close examination showed it had been re-blued earlier.

I am new to older shotguns and know nothing at all about this one other than it is no. 1 of a pair.

Should I have Dan check the barrels out for thickness while he has it? And does this affect its original proof. If so, ought I to have it re-proofed.

Thus my concern about shot shell pressure and why I originally asked about the difference in the two makers' shells.

I just don't want my ignorance to be a problem for the gun.

The seller, who is well known and respected, recommended RST and i heard about Polywad.

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Dogchaser37
PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 3:43 am  Reply with quote
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You need to know what the proof marks are, barrel thickness really wont tell you much. The proof marks should be on or near the monoblock.

A lot of folks do not understand the effects of pressure, velocity and recoil, and will give all sorts of incorrect advice about what ammunition is correct.

RST is supposedly the 'safe' choice, because of the lower recoil they produce, by the use of light payloads and lower velocities. That is important so that you don't crack the old wood. However you can get light payloads and low velocities in other ammo not just RST.

RST claim low pressure, but that is a relative term, and does every lot of RST ammo actually produce 'low pressure' or is it just certain loads that do? What is the pressure of the RST loads? That is what you need to match up to the proof marks on your shotgun.

Please don't take this as a sucker shot against RST, just trying to get you the correct ammunition for your shotgun.

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tda003
PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 5:55 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 12 Apr 2017
Posts: 60
Location: St. Simons Island, GA

My lack of knowledge about shotgun ballistics and pretty much everything to do with shotgun ammunition is encyclopedic.

In fact, all I've ever done is buy good shells as they appear on sale. This pretty much goes for all the ammo I buy. If, however, the zombie apocalypse actually does occur, I'm pretty well covered.

Until now. This is the first older shotgun I've owned. I bought it because it was pretty, had nice engraving, lovely lines, very good wood and mounted well.

If I hadn't been warned to use lower pressure ammo, I'd have thrown whatever 16 gauge target shells I had on hand in it and attempted to frighten clay pigeons.

I won't know the proof marks until I get it back and will be able to date it by serial number at that time also.

I also bought a Galazan chamber and choke gauge to verify those items upon its homecoming. Just for fun, I checked my unfired AyA no.2 20 gauge which, according to AyA, has 2 3/4 chambers and is choked M & IC. The gauge told me that it had 3 1/4" cambers and was choked cylinder & cylinder. This isn't going well. My ignorance has been blissful.

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16gaDavis
PostPosted: Thu May 18, 2017 8:49 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 24 Jun 2013
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Location: canandaigua - western n.y. (formerly deerhunter)

the EASY way to check a chamber length is to cut a credit card to the chamber diam and see where it hangs up . Just to verify the choke without going bonkers , is to clean the bores well and see if there is a ring down there . If there is , then the real choke is what you get with the particular ammo you shoot , which CAN be a lot different than the barrel markings .

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