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Guest

Nice write up Mike. I agree with most of it but I've got to call you on one comment. Have you ever tried the SG20L wad?

Here is a picture of some 7/8 oz loads using the SG20L and International Clays. No filler is used in this load. Velocity is 1200 fps @ 9000psi. I've been shooting it for three years without a single blooper. This load is in the 16 gauge group spread sheet.

I can live with these crimps. It sure is nice not to mess around with fillers! Smile

Member Joined: 08 Nov 2005 Posts: 3438 Location: Illinois

Mike join the 16 ga. society and your troubles will be cured Wink

I load the same hull with a 3/4 oz that will function my autos but I use a filler--don't really pay it no mind whether hunting or trying to bust a skeet target Wink

Kinda like a small ticker tape parade at every shot Twisted Evil

Especially the older 8pt crimps what have a little extra space inside

Member Joined: 16 Nov 2006 Posts: 1338

Guest

Mike,
Great post! Photos really help tell the story.

I know the 16 ga reloading group is "low pressure" but our results are often not. Loads developed run the gamut from sub-1000fps loads that are likely to be squibs to 1300fps+ and some pressures that are way too high(12000psi).Many 7/8 oz loads and some 3/4oz loads. But also some 1 1/8 oz loads and even some Bismuth data where non-tox is required.
And if you have a pet load, you can get it tested and see what pressure/velocity you're using.

That's how we come up with loads like Dave mentioned using the SG20 wad. Other 20 ga wads have also been used (Orange Duster, Federal etc) in the Rem hull.

Guess I'm kind of a cheerleader but I have really found lots of useful information after joining the group.

Jeff

Member Joined: 16 Nov 2006 Posts: 1338

Guest

Try using the Gualandi 2025 wad sold by Graf and Sons. I think that you will find it is a perfect fit for 7/8th ounce loads in the Black Remington or old Winchester compression formed hulls without filler . They are designed for 7/8th ounce loads. I am pretty sure that the SG20L is the same as the Gualandi 2021B which is designed for 1 ounce loads.

Guest

Twice Barrel, the Graf's Gualandi 2025 is the same wad as the Ballistic Products "SG20L." You're right, they do work well, and I buy mine from Graf's, too! $89.99 per 5000 with free shipping. My last 5000 were priced at $69.99, but unfortunately like everything else they have went up in price. Still a better price than any of the others, and you don't have to spend money or time on fillers. (but you knew that) Smile

These are the loads I use for skeet and "fun" clays in my 6lb 16 gauge.

Member Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 317

The Orange duster 20 ga. wad works well too. Not all 20 ga. win wad clones work as well as the Orange Duster. Guess its the flexibility of the plastic. Russ

Member Joined: 17 Jan 2005 Posts: 138 Location: Parma, OH

Mike, instead of lengthening the wad, why don't you try shortening the hull? 2-1/2" loads should cycle just fine in any auto. You've gone this far, why not go all the way? Very Happy

Also, if you're considering the 20 gauge wad, be sure to use a big flake powder like 800X, Blue Dot, etc. so you don't start having problems with powder migration.

BTW, I'm a member of the 16ga reloading group. I'm working on the old style "cup wad" loads that Winchester used to make in the 1950's (I like confetti.) Point is, we all do different things in the group. If we stumble on a low pressure combo then it's a bonus. Besides, what else can you buy for $20 these days? A tank of gas? NOT! Laughing

Mike Doerner

Member Joined: 25 Jul 2006 Posts: 781

I second the motion on cutting down 16's, and you dont have to go all the way to 2 1/2". Just take them down to where you get a perfect crimp.

I started cutting down hulls to shoot in my 65mm chambered '23 A5. That's 2 9/16"......I found that it gives me a lot of leeway on 7/8 oz loads.

I have not settled on final recipes yet as I'm still messing around trying to find the lightest load that will reliably cycle this old A5, and what with hunting and work getting in the way this may take awhile.

Jeff

Most of the regulars know by now that I've been using the R16 and one or two 28 ga. .135" thick card wads for my 7/8 and 3/4 ounce loads. I tried the Federal 20S1 wads as a substitute, but it still needs a filler wad. I'm so practiced at inserting the 28 ga wads now, that its not any slower to load them than no filler wads at all. I've not had any confetti either.

I use 16.5 grains of Green Dot, which is about the same in burn rate as International clays. Unique is too slow for these light loads as is Universal clays. These two work very well in 1 ounce loads though.

I've found the Gualandi 16 ga. wads are too tight a fit in the Remington hull. The B&P 20 ga. Z wad is supposedly the biggest diameter 20 ga wad made, even bigger than the G wads. If this is true, the 7/8 ounce model should work quite well as a substitute. I like its configuration much better than the GL wads for a number of reasons. However, at this time, its not being imported.

I was the ramrod behind the R16 availability movement. We were down to no suitable 1 ounce wad for the Remington hull, unless you adapted the SP-16. My aim was to preserve as much of what is available than any other reason.

I'd like to see one of our wad companies introduce a 16 ga wad suitable for 3/4 to 7/8 ounce loads in the Remington as well as the straight wall cases. Technically, it can easily be done. Finacially, it won't be cheap. However, I'm betting the wads would sell like hotcakes, based on how fast the R16 wads sold.

Finally, your idea of spinning a plumb bob in the shell mouth is a good one. I can easily see why you need to if you are using GL16 wads. However, so far, I've not had any real problems seating an R16 or SP-16 wad into a Remington hull on my MEC Grabber without ironing thm out first. The plastic wad guide fingers work very well for me. They don't work well with the G wad. Seating tem stretches the mouth too much and causes too many premature splits. I've also broken off some of the wad guide fingers with the G wads. I'm also not too thrilled with the very shallow capacity shot cups or the overly stiff wad base either.

Guest

Member Joined: 16 Nov 2006 Posts: 1338