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yugami
PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 7:25 am  Reply with quote
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In my inexperience I went ahead and bought a lee load all for my 2 9/16 chambered Winchester Model 12 16ga. Knowing the limitations on size and having some idea of the changes needed I made a precision riser to use on the pre crimp and crimp stations. Then installed a 1/2" longer plastic self taps on the metal plate which allow it to go up and down as needed during the process.

I bought Cheddite 2 3/4 hulls from Midway along with BPI Hull trimmer. Then made a spacer for the trimmer to shift it the extra 1/16 if I decided to go that way vs the 2 1/2.

I have a ton of z-16 hulls mistakenly buying them twice when I thought I was buying BP SG-16's the second time.

So all that aside - I'm having some issues with crimps not staying closed and would like some guidence on where to buy supplies for my waterfowl load targeting 1oz of Bismouth or slightly more.


Using 19.9 grains of Universal, z-16 hulls with 7/8 oz No8 lead as an experimental load.
Some of my crimps are slowly blooming back open. I did 5 hulls last night and 4 of them are like this. Is it a problem with not enough space? Should I just buy a better crimper? Some of my loads look factory (20 out of 30) and others (the other 10) are opening back up. Even putting them back in the crimper doesn't fix them long term.

Is it due to the Z-16 hulls vs the BP-SG-16's? Should I break this load down and start over? Its all experimental so I'm not against that.

Where can I find the right components?
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skeettx
PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 11:53 am  Reply with quote
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Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Posts: 9455
Location: Amarillo, Texas

Yes, not enough space,
And if you feel like you do not want to download them, I just
use candle wax to seal up the crimp so shot does not fall out
and use them at the skeet range.
Mike

https://www.precisionreloading.com/cart.php#!c=14&ga=16%20Gauge

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/wad_page.asp

https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/438

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WyoChukar
PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 12:54 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 16 Jul 2015
Posts: 2124
Location: Hudson,Wy

My first loader was a Lee Loadall. Unfortunately, the crimp dies are not adjustable. What I found was that with compression formed hulls, I had a little leeway for crimps since the crimps seemed to hold tighter. With all other hulls, column height had to be perfect. Increased wad pressure helps with very slight height issues, but I mean minuscule amounts.

Beyond that, I had to find the right wad and many times it was the next highest capacity wad that did the trick. Another good option is to use powder that takes up little space in the hull. My Longshot recipes show a noticeably lower powder height than say my Green Dot or 800-X loads. Good luck and keep us posted; we will help however we can.

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fn16ga
PostPosted: Sat Sep 01, 2018 5:28 pm  Reply with quote
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Joined: 09 Jan 2013
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You have plenty of space with the z-16 wad .You will have a shorter wad column with z-16 than you will with sg-16 .

If the hulls are new they don,t have any crimp memory , you may have to re- crimp them a couple times before they will stay closed . Especially if your not getting a good roll over to lock them in.


Last edited by fn16ga on Sun Sep 02, 2018 3:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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putz463
PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 2:31 am  Reply with quote
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fn16ga wrote:
If the hulls are new they don,t have any crimp memory , you may have to re- crimp them a couple time before they will stay closed . Especially if your not getting a good roll over to lock them in.


Agree, I find putting a washer in the pre crimp stage to get that first pre crimp to set a little deeper helps.

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yugami
PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2018 5:21 pm  Reply with quote
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putz463 wrote:
fn16ga wrote:
If the hulls are new they don,t have any crimp memory , you may have to re- crimp them a couple time before they will stay closed . Especially if your not getting a good roll over to lock them in.


Agree, I find putting a washer in the pre crimp stage to get that first pre crimp to set a little deeper helps.


I went back and touched a few up by tamping them down better then using a 3/16 spacer for the pre crimp and a 1/4 spacer for the final crimp.

If I tried the new 1/4 on the pre I was buckling the hulls a little but using it on the final crimp gave me a more consistent roll and flatter crimp so far everything is staying closed now as long as its not over full.

Running the 1oz bushing now and getting good closure.
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fn16ga
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 3:59 am  Reply with quote
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No sure if it was mentioned but you need to actually weigh what your powder and shot bushings are dropping .

What load are you using ?
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yugami
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 6:38 am  Reply with quote
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fn16ga wrote:
No sure if it was mentioned but you need to actually weigh what your powder and shot bushings are dropping .

What load are you using ?


I've got a little grain scale setup.

I've now loaded two setups.

Universal powder with No 8 lead in the 7/8 bushing (dropping just shy of 7/Cool with overshot card and then upgraded to 1oz no card better packing. Then switched to Longshot with No. 4 Bismuth

Same case/wad. The No 4 bismuth in the 1 oz is dropping 7/8 oz actual weight. But its filling the case/wad nicely. I can't see getting upto a full ounce of actual weight without changing something.

I'll be shooting ducks at sub 40 on the farm pond if this patterns well. The no.8 is just for fun shooting clays in the back field.

Using the 16ga reloaders group spreadsheet to get powder weights dialed and reviewing 5 to 10 samples of each setup prior to actually reloading to make sure everything stays consistent.
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