16ga.com ~ View topic

Member Joined: 06 Sep 2005 Posts: 26 Location: Out West

I got a recipe from the 16 ga reloading group for a 7/8 oz load. 16.5 gr. Universal Clays, Rem black hull, Remington R-16, 1 oz wad with a 28 ga card over the shot. Would it make a difference to put the 28 ga card in the wad cup first? Cause that's what I did. Nice crimps, no bulges, looks great. Probably should have read the recipe a little closer. What do you experienced guys think??

Chris

Member Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 1545 Location: Michigan

You'll be just fine. I prefer to place it in the bottom of the shot cup.

Member Joined: 08 Nov 2005 Posts: 3438 Location: Illinois

I load mine with it on top-just more better for me ----I have also had good results down to 3/4 oz loads.Went down to 5/8's Embarassed

---not good results.The bottom line is just to make sure the filler don't end up in the drop tube Wink

Make sure to use a bulky powder to help fill up that space------

I also put mine on the bottom.

Dennis

Guest

Same here....on the bottom.

this is basically the same load I've been strumping for some time now except I use 16 grains of Green dot, which burns a bit cleaner for me. I can remember having a couple of interesting "discussions" with folks who insisted I was goofy for inserting a 28 ga. card wad in the cup first, the suggested way by both Lyman and Alliant in their manuals.

Well, now I put it in the middle just to make everyone happy---Not!!! Laughing

Bottoms up..., er...down,... ah heck, you know what I mean. Rolling Eyes

Member Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 450 Location: Indiana

Bottom for me.

Gentlemen:

NO ENDORSEMENT of this loading implied - for your consideration ONLY.

I have evolved to the following loading in the black remington hulls

3/4 ounce 8.5s

remington primers

14 grains green dot

20 ga 7/8 oz gualandi wads (gu2025) from Grafs

no fillers - crimp dimpled in slightly

pleasant, low recoil (in the 28 ga I use 12.5 grains green dot) skeet load

next summer I will submit for testing.....

Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 124 Location: Kansas City

Is there any difference in pattern top vs bottom?

Guest

Clays that looks like a very pleasant load.

Should test out about 7000 psi at about 1100 fps.

Matt, theoretically, the 28 ga wad under the shot should pattern better. However, I doubt you'd see much difference on paper. It's just simpler and faster to insert the 28 ga. card wad into the R16 wad just prior to placing it in the wad guide. It's really one move if you do it right by using both hands. Then, simply pulling the press handle dumps the shot into the wad cup on a progressive press. On a single stage press, you can pull the handle and dump the shot manually. You don't have to perform an extra seperate operation to seat the card wad on top of the shot. Its also neater and there is less risk of mis-seating the card wad on top. In reloading always follow the KISS method if you can.

I love roll crimp!! ..... I also love to pattern!

With this said, even a .045" card on top of the shot causes trouble sometimes.....

Don't plan to shoot a couple of patterns and expect to learn much....

A "bad" pattern may show up only once in ten..... And I have found it to almost go away with #5 and larger shot....

As we are talking 7/8oz with probably 7 1/2 or smaller shot, a filler card wad above the shot charge spells trouble.. Every shot? No... Patterns seem to displace shot more that "blow" patterns.... If you eyeball what appears to be one side of the pattern having more shot in it you can draw a line seperating the pattern into two halves.... I have seen 75% of the shot charge in one half moon of the pattern even with the thinner card, and it can occur anywhere.... Top, bottom, right, left.......and whenever it "feels" like it as well!

So the moral of this story is a card should go on the bottom of the shot charge for best results. Of course the very best choice IS NO FILLER. If quality shot to shot performance matters less than convenience, then one will face the "funny" patterns explained above whenever the card decides to be a "rudder" for a time before it is pushed aside.....

Slidehammer

Geez, this guy sounds as goofy as I do. I like him. Laughing

...and theoretically, he's right.

Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 124 Location: Kansas City

It makes sense that putting a fiber wad on top would have some effect on the pattern. The wad would be slowing at a much faster rate then the shot and would cause at least some disruption of the pattern. I've been considering using a card on top of the shot due to problems getting a good crimp. No matter how I adjust every few rounds I'll get a hole in the center of the crimp large enough to let shot leak out.

Matt, it would help if you tell us what recipe and componants you are loading. If you are loading an R16 or SP-16 wad into a Reminton case, there might be a couple of aspects that are messing you up.

You might need a thicker card wad or two of them in the shotcup. I use two .135" thick 28 ga card wads in my 3/4 ounce load in a Remington hull, an R16 wad, and 16 grains of Green Dot. I get a very slightly dished crimp, but no hole. You might also need to lower your crimp starter die down to put more hull mouth into the center of the crimp.