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Joined: 11 Jul 2004 Posts: 92 Location: Pa

When looking to for new loads what is more important velocity or shot load? Im looking good grouse load. ill be going to the UP this fall so looking for a good load for the trip. I have RGL hulls and Active hulls so that covers a lot capacity. I knew a guy that had a load he loved that 7/8 and fast.

My opinion:

For targets I like about 1200 fps

For game, give me velocity

Mike

Guest

1150-1200 is plenty of velocity for ruffed grouse. Hard to improve on 1 oz. of 7.5's in this range. Nothing wrong with 1 oz. factory loads from Remington, Winchester, or Federal if you don't come up with your own.

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1840 Location: Central ND

Ken,

You are going to see everything from 1100 FPS to 1400+ FPS. #9's to #4's and 1/2 oz. to 1 3/8 oz.

Somewhere in there is the right velocity, shot size and payload that fits your hunting/clays situation.

IMHO, using 2 3/4" hulls - 7/8 oz., 1 oz. and 1 1/8 oz. load fit the 16 perfectly. Velocities from 1200 to 1300 FPS are about right, but I don't mind pushing the 7/8 oz. loads a bit faster. Shot sizes from #9 to #5 are very useful and they pattern well in the 16.

Member Joined: 30 Nov 2011 Posts: 1696 Location: Minnesota

Ken +1 on what Dave says. Now, if you want to get into overthinking it;
If using a pump or semi,the one in the pipe is a 7/8 oz of 8's and the ones in the mag are 1oz 6's. If using a SxS ,especially a double trigger, the right barrel gets the 7/8 oz load and the left gets the 1oz of sixes. these combos are great when youre just as likely to flush a woodcock as a grouse. For just grouse, I've moved more into the 6's camp with the probably erroneous belief that they penetrate the leaves/brush better.
Now PLEASE don't ask what chokes are best. Laughing

In my way of thinking, 7 1/2's and smaller are for targets, which are fragile and often give one only an edge profile to hit (skeet and some sporties), so pattern density is important. Game shot starts at #7 for me, no matter how small the bird, how open the choke or how close the bird. If you think that 7's vs. 7 1/2's is splitting hairs, note that a #7 has, at any given velocity about 17% greater energy than a #7 1/2. Of course, any given charge of shot #7's has that same 17% fewer pellets than the same charge of #7 1/2's. I think 300 pellets in a one ounce pattern of #7's properly choked for the range and size of the target is plenty dense enough for the smallest of upland birds, except maybe hummingbirds, but the limit on those is too small to make much of a meal anyway. As the bird gets larger and/or range is further, a greater pellet energy is necessary to insure a solid downing of the bird, and the trade-off in pattern density made by selecting larger shot is justifiable and sensible.

Now, using the only remaining channel of dispute on the comparison of 7's and 7 1/2's, some will say, "But I'll get 17% more pellets on the bird!" OK, I'll grant you that, but please tell me how many pellets that would be? If you are used to getting 6 pellets of #7's in your bird, and that is a lot, you'll get maybe one more with 7 1/2's. Now look at how much further down range the #7 retains the same energy as the #7 1/2. It's going to be about 17% further. That means the #7 retains as much energy at 30 yards as the 7 1/2 does at 25 -- as much energy at 45 as the 7 1/2 has at 38. I like my odds with the #7.

I can regularly drop pen raised chukar at 40-45yards with 7.5s. Just my experience. I don’t get much chance to hunt wild birds, except dove, and 7.5 or 8 shot seems to work fine. Ymmv.

Guest

Joined: 28 Mar 2008 Posts: 1460 Location: Eagle, Nebraska

hunted ruffies and blues a few times, I used 1 1/16oz of #7 shot with a spreader insert, about 1300+ fps. Not unusual, use it on early phez in first barrel ( in my neck of woods, might encounter quail too) chukar and huns too.
Works great.
I used longshot and a z trap commander wad, cheddite hull.

Most importantly is the velocity to match YOUR TIMING , missing is a mute point .

Roll up your sleeves and put in the due diligence.

Tradition and always have done it this or that way is great , but if one wants to find out for themselves what is best then one has to do the work.

Give me small payloads of small shot at higher than accepted as the normal velocity , less wear and tear on the gun and shooter .

Dead birds can't tell the difference.

Regards Nick

Dave Erickson says

Guest

Tony, you really can't even see beyond 30 yards where I hunt ruffed grouse.

I don't use 7.5's on the prairie. I'm with you on your logic, and Brit 6's which are about US 6.5 size are about as small as I go when not in the ruffed grouse thickets.

Hey Dave and Maximum :

How about you fellers lining up a really dense population of Ruff Grouse , I have been wanting to hunt that bird .

We will take one day and you fellers take all the data and measurements of all aspects of my shooting with tiny loads and report back the findings.

Too bad you didn't make it out to the reservation Dave it was world class hunting back then , now you have to work for them .

This would be real fun data to post.

Regards Nick

Guest

Sounds good, Nick. I have no doubt you'd do very well with your loads. I'd like to see them in action.

I've always had to work for my birds, and I prefer it that way.

I used to have a buddy who only hunted game farms, still does. Many years ago I invited him to hunt wild birds with me and when I said I couldn't guarantee a limit every time, and we might even get skunked he couldn't get himself to do it. I came to appreciate his choice.

Joined: 08 Feb 2009 Posts: 1308 Location: Western WA

Here’s the flip side of the coin:

Way back in the day I took a crossing shot at a pheasant about 35 yds out. It was a 12 ga load of No. 4. Away it kept flying as we watched it glide to land in a dirt patch about a quarter mile away.

Then my buddy said “Hey, it bounced!” We hurried over and sure enough there it was, stone dead. That evening I cleaned it carefully and found where FOUR pellets (if not five or six) went completely through the chest cavity and out the other side. So much for penetration and energy!

For me it cements the old guideline “break a wing and a leg” which argues for more, not larger, pellets.

Ok this was a pheasant not a grouse which sometimes die of fright it seems, having once bagged one with .22 BIRDSHOT!

Either way I’m switching from 7 1/2 to 6 for grouse just to plow through the thick evergreen foliage out here.

Cheers
B.

PS Tradition has it out here that the preferred (and legal!) load for grouse is .270 Winchester by bored and hungry deer hunters. I’ll break with tradition in that respect however.