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Joined: 21 Mar 2019 Posts: 523 Location: Texas

Mine were also new within the last couple years. Bought at local gun club.

Joined: 09 Feb 2020 Posts: 64 Location: Southern Illinois

This is ALWAYS a good subject to post on. Thanks!

Thanks, MSM, for conducting a more or less 'scientific" test of the various hulls. Most of us don't do that--we just use experience and observations to come to conclusions. While some of those may be valid, there are a lot of factors that could influence the results.

Since you report on three different "Cheddite-type" hulls, here are my observations on some of those, mostly loaded with light steel bird hunting loads or 1 oz lead, with American company hulls included.

Best: Win CF, particularly Dove and Quail 8 star crimps (No longer sold, but the scrounger can still come up with quite a few of these.)
PMC high brass hulls (thicker plastic, good crimps, little splitting or pin-holing of crimps. One doesn't see PMC shells a lot in U.S., but I have had good luck with them.
Next best: Surprise, Nobel Sport low brass. Tough little hulls.
Green high brass Remington hulls. Old Win CF high brass with 6 star fused crimps (ugly crimps but tough).
The big group, fair: Most of these seem to me to be about the same reloadability: Win/Cheddite, Rio, Rem black, Federal, Kent, about 3 reloads for most.
Worst: Fiocchi. a lot of new shells split crimps when fired, most reloads do same, flimsy plastic, poor crimps.

Since most of my shooting has been hunting-related all these year, Win CF hulls are hands down my favorite, as the thicker base one piece plastic doesn't swell in chambers when fired and is very reliable. I can't say that for field reliability for some of the others, particularly Fiocchis.

Your results may be different. Again, mine are based on observations. A lot of good information from all of the above responders. Thanks.

GREAT

Do you have a pet load in 7/8 ounce for the WIN CF 8 point crimp hulls?

Thank you
Mike

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1840 Location: Central ND

I too like the Winchester CF hulls, but I am not a scrounger and will not make the effort to find them.

The toughest hulls I have ever seen were Winchester 2 piece hulls made around 1999 to 2002-3-4. They were originally loaded in Italy when Winchester stopped making the CF hull. I have a bunch of these hulls that have 4 transducer witness marks in them from when I tested the loads for Precision Reloading. I have put another 2 reloads on them and there isn't any part of the hull that is ready to give up.

These hulls were the predecessor of the Cheddite hulls we got when Winchester went to Australia.

If you look very close, 1 inch up from the rim, between the numbers and the word Game, you can see a transducer witness mark on these Winchester hulls. They are the ones made in Italy. Including the 4 times they were used in testing they have 2 more firings on them for a total of 6.

These are the Remington's with 3 firings on them.

These Cheddites have been fired 4 times.

And finally everyone's favorite the Winchester CF with 3 firings on them.

I have maybe 200 CF's left, none once fired, but I shoot my 1100 so much and I am afraid to lose them. Someday I will start using them with my Citori & Hunter Special.

MSM,
I enjoyed your mention of the two piece Winchester hulls sold for a few years after CF hulls were discontinued. I bought a flat of these a couple of years ago, but haven't reloaded any yet--still accumulating hulls. Looking at the beautiful 8 star crimp on them (looks life CF Dove and Quail!) and other features, I wondered if they wouldn't make excellent reloading hulls. I think you answered my question. Looking forward to giving them a try soon.

Forgot Herter's in my list above. I put them in the fair group; fairly nice crimps, but splits also fairly soon--thin plastic.

No 7/8 loads for me--I'm trying to shoot up all these bags of lead in the floor under my bench! A few years ago I thought I was running out of lead shot about the time that it spiked in price, but several estate sales later now makes me wonder what I an going to do with all that lead! All 1oz or 1 and an eighth for me.

mw

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1840 Location: Central ND

4setters,

Having lots of lead is a nice problem to have!!

The Winchester made in Italy hulls are roomy like the Cheddite/Herter/RIO hulls.

Joined: 04 Mar 2019 Posts: 1840 Location: Central ND

Update,

The Winchester hulls made in Italy, have been reloaded 7 times and are starting to split on the crimp folds. I tossed a few out.

The Winchester/Cheddites (low brass) look good after 3 reloads but I did toss a couple with splits at the crimp folds.

Federals, I have 4 to 5 reloads on them, have tossed a few but not many. They are getting towards the end. Starting to leak around the primers.

The Winchester/Cheddites with high brass are junk after one reload. Lots of splits down the length of the crimp with some 1/8" or so past the shoulder.

I had some Herter's (the ones from 2 years ago) , both high and low brass, junk after 1 reload. Lots of splits in the crimp folds.

All of the above have the same basic set of components in them. Either Federal 209A or Winchester primers. 20.5 grains Universal, B & P Z2M wad and 1 oz. of shot. Depending on which hull and primer are used the velocity is in the 1230 to 1260 FPS range and pressure is 9,000 PSI to 10,400 PSI.

Guest

Good info, Mark.

Back about 15-20 years ago my shooting buddy and I would scour the area for the Australian manufactured Winchesters because they were the softest shooting 1 oz. 16's around at the time, and I was in deep messing with SxS game guns. The Italian made Winchesters were noticeably hotter and the box labels and specs were identical except for the fine print showing the origin. I had no idea the hulls on the Italians were so much better, but the Aussie hulls didn't last long.

That said, I remember being bummed out when the Australian Winchesters dried up and it made me realize that when something good 16 gauge comes along (wads, loads, et al) you'd best buy a lot because they might be gone tomorrow.

Member Joined: 30 Nov 2011 Posts: 1696 Location: Minnesota

Plus one on what Dave says about the Win 1 oz game loads being soft shooting. A small chrono test I ran showed 1149,1178,1129,1148,1187. I have gotten a little better life out of the hulls, just redone for 3rd time with 7/8 oz DR16,w209 and either GD or INTL