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salish
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 8:00 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

Congratulations to me, I have a "new" 16ga gun. It's a pawn shop gun, with a couple of issues, but solid and very huntable and I got it for a very low price. I have hunted with a Remington Model 11 Standard model in 20ga made in 1939 for over 30 years. I like hunting these old humpback shotguns almost as much as my old nickel steel Model 12's. This is my first 16ga autoloader. The gun has a 30" full choke barrel, and it's serial number reveals that it was made during the last year of production, 1948. With the long barrel and full choke I assume it was a waterfowl gun?

I shoot off the left shoulder so I will be looking for a left-hand safety, does anyone know if these are still made, and if so, where? Maybe Arts Gun Shop? And if I can find one is the install something a novice could do, or a competent gunsmith? Also, would Briley or another screw-in choke maker be able to install removable chokes in an older gun like this? I really don't hunt waterfowl much and a full choke might be overdoing it a little bit for the places I hunt chukar, otherise, it might be the perfect chukar gun.

It's the bottom gun in my photo. The Model 11 in the top is my Model 11 20ga.

Thank you,

Cliff
Seattle
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stevesavage
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:21 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Apr 2017
Posts: 150

I don’t know about the safety. Extra barrels shouldn’t be hard to find on E-bay. I believe I have a couple plus one with a poly choke. All extra barrels were inexpensive?Easy to swap out. My model 11 came with a full choke and I like a full choke barrel Good luck.
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stevesavage
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:22 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Apr 2017
Posts: 150

I don’t know about the safety. Extra barrels shouldn’t be hard to find on E-bay. I believe I have a couple plus one with a poly choke. All extra barrels were inexpensive?Easy to swap out. My model 11 came with a full choke and I like a full choke barrel Good luck.
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salish
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 11:45 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

Thank you. I will take a look at ebay. Do you feel the vintage polychokes work as advertised, and would they still perform as well with modern nontoxic shot like the shells from Boss and Bismuth?

And do you prefer a full choke because of longer range shooting?

Thanks,
Cliff
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Researcher
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 1:14 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Jun 2009
Posts: 695
Location: WA/AK

Remington Arms Co., Inc. introduced their 16-gauge autoloaders, Model 11 and "Sportsman" in 1931. The new 16-gauge autoloaders were made for 2 3/4-inch shells, and Remington introduced a new bit hotter shell for them. Remington's Nitro Express 16-gauge shell was put up in the long "standard" 2 9/16-inch shell with a load of 3 drams equiv. pushing 1 1/8 ounce of shot. The new 2 3/4-inch shell was called the Auto-Express and carried a load of 3 1/4 drams equiv. pushing that 1 1/8 ounce of shot.



When introduced, the 16-gauge Model 11 serial numbers began at 1500000 and the 16-gauge "Sportsman" serial numbers began at S200000. I don't know when, but by the 207xxx range they were no longer using the S preface for the "Sportsman" serial numbers.

Early guns had "The Sportsman" roll-stamped on the left side of the receiver and a three-bird roll-stamped scene on both sides of the receiver.



By early 1936 they had reduced the game scene roll-stamping to one bird on each side. On September 28, 1937, Remington stopped the separate serial number sequence for the 16-gauge "Sportsman" and began serial numbering them right along with the 16-gauge Model 11s. Along with this they moved "The Sportsman" from the left side of the receiver to the bolt.



My 16-gauge "Sportsman" is of 1938 vintage with a 26-inch solid rib IMP CYL barrel. It holds the distinction of my only triple on pheasants,


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salish
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 2:20 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

Researcher, this is an unbelievable amount of info, thank you very much.

Cliff
Seattle
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Researcher
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 2:20 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Jun 2009
Posts: 695
Location: WA/AK

Your "Sportsman" must have after-market wood, as the "Sportsman" always came with checkered wood.

Early on "The Sportsman" had quite a large patch of checkering on the grip.



Through the mid-1930s the grip checkering was as on my 16-gauge, the middle gun here.



By 1939 they were down to the little triangular patch as the top gun, a 1941 12-gauge. That little triangle of grip checkering remained through the end, my 1948 20-gauge bottom.

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salish
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 2:23 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

Researcher wrote:
Your "Sportsman" must have after-market wood, as the "Sportsman" always came with checkered wood.

Early on "The Sportsman" had quite a large patch of checkering on the grip.



Through the mid-1930s the grip checkering was as on my 16-gauge, the middle gun here.



By 1939 they were down to the little triangular patch as the top gun, a 1941 12-gauge. That little triangle of grip checkering remained through the end, my 1948 20-gauge bottom.


I was wondering about that. I couldn't find any photo of Sportsman guns with smooth wood.
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salish
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 2:46 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

salish wrote:
Researcher, this is an unbelievable amount of info, thank you very much.

Cliff
Seattle


As long as I have your attention, do you know if both the Sportsman and standard Model 11's came from the factory with neutral cast stocks?
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Researcher
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 3:23 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Jun 2009
Posts: 695
Location: WA/AK

I'm sure they did. Most of the time if an American gun exhibits any cast, it warped or was bent sometime after it was built.

What part of Seattle? I grew up on Quen Anne -- North Queen Anne Grade School, Queen Anne Jr-Sr Highschool, U of W. They're making a little less noise at Montlake since Arizona just scored!!

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salish
PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2022 6:04 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

[quote="Researcher"]I'm sure they did. Most of the time if an American gun exhibits any cast, it warped or was bent sometime after it was built.

What part of Seattle? I grew up on Quen Anne -- North Queen Anne Grade School, Queen Anne Jr-Sr Highschool, U of W. They're making a little less noise at Montlake since Arizona just scored!![/quot

Thanks. North end kid here. Ingraham, UW. I work on Montlake so im happy when its quiet

e]
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Brewster11
PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:01 pm  Reply with quote



Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 1301
Location: Western WA

Well done Salish, acquisition deemed outstanding by this Coug (by paternity of a Coug son, whereas the UW daughters didn’t find me as much as admission to a practice squad scrimmage).

We did attend the MSU game, almost as loud as standing next to Nitro Express Polychoke round.

I urge shun the polychoke, notwithstanding my quite successful use of one in a M12 for twenty plus seasons with lead and steel. Heard too many stories of polychokes disappearing off the end of the muzzle with the rest of the shot.

Rather than changing the choke, consider learning how to shoot the heads off upland birds!

V/R
B.

PM me about a terrific [wild] pheasant locale I recently stumbled across in WA.
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Researcher
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2022 8:07 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 13 Jun 2009
Posts: 695
Location: WA/AK

Quote:
I urge shun the polychoke, notwithstanding my quite successful use of one in a M12 for twenty plus seasons with lead and steel. Heard too many stories of polychokes disappearing off the end of the muzzle with the rest of the shot.


Can't happen with a Remington factory Poly-Choke from the Model 31, Model 11, Sportsman era. They were milled integral with the barrel --




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salish
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2022 8:31 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

Brewster11 wrote:
Well done Salish, acquisition deemed outstanding by this Coug (by paternity of a Coug son, whereas the UW daughters didn’t find me as much as admission to a practice squad scrimmage).

We did attend the MSU game, almost as loud as standing next to Nitro Express Polychoke round.

I urge shun the polychoke, notwithstanding my quite successful use of one in a M12 for twenty plus seasons with lead and steel. Heard too many stories of polychokes disappearing off the end of the muzzle with the rest of the shot.

Rather than changing the choke, consider learning how to shoot the heads off upland birds!

V/R

PM me about a terrific [wild] pheasant locale I recently stumbled across in WA.


Thanks Brewster11, my mother grew up during part of youth in the palouse so I'm a coug at heart. Grew up hunting and fishing in Seattle but our compass needle always pointed to east of the mountains to hunt birds. I appreciate your advice on the polychoke. Before I do anything with this barrel I'm going to pattern the gun. I was planning on doing that this week while hunting chukar up in the Quilomene, but it appears I broke my little toe and I need to stay off my foot for a couple of days.
Thank you for the rooster offer. I'll PM you.
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salish
PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2022 8:33 am  Reply with quote



Joined: 19 Oct 2015
Posts: 94
Location: seattle, wa

Researcher wrote:
Quote:
I urge shun the polychoke, notwithstanding my quite successful use of one in a M12 for twenty plus seasons with lead and steel. Heard too many stories of polychokes disappearing off the end of the muzzle with the rest of the shot.


Can't happen with a Remington factory Poly-Choke from the Model 31, Model 11, Sportsman era. They were milled integral with the barrel --





Researcher, how do you tell if the polychoke is a Remington installed choke, is the choke labeled? It's hard to read the stamping in this pic. Thank you for posting it.
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