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< 16ga. Ammunition & Reloading ~ Might be a Longshot |
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Posted:
Mon Oct 30, 2023 4:15 pm
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Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 452
Location: WI
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I have a 2-3/4" 1oz recipe from the Lyman book that calls for:
Fiocchi hull
23gr Longshot
Win 209
BPI SG-16
This looks like a decent velocity lower pressure load (1250 fps @ 7100 psi).
This is similar to a load from Hodgdon in a Federal hull with 26.5gr Longshot listed at 1350 fps @ 7700psi.
I've run into a couple of concerns though:
First, I've found that the Federal hull ID is smaller than the Fiocchi, so it definitely gives a better seal on the wad, but as the listed powder weights are also not the same, there's no way of knowing how the first load will act in a Federal hull.
Second, I ran a couple test loadings to see how it would go, and the 1oz load won't let the crimp close. In fact, it won't even close fully on a 2-3/4" hull. If I set it so the crimp is around 0.030" deep, the hull buckles. I just couldn't get the press dialed in to work with this load, so I switched gears.
I'd like to find a Longshot load for a 2-9/16" hull, either Fiocchi or Federal (I have a LOT of Federal once-fired hulls and a few pounds of Longshot), so in the interest of science I popped in the MEC short kit, and found the first recipe makes for a very nice looking load with 7/8oz in a Federal hull trimmed to 2-9/16". I haven't tried a test load with the Fiocchi hulls yet.
I wasn't really planning on firing these 2-9/16" rounds, as I don't trust any unpublished/tested load even when comparatively speaking it approximates other published loads, but the site has been kinda slow lately so I thought I'd throw this out there and maybe stimulate some discussion.
And all I can do is discuss, as I'm traveling this week and don't have access to any of my reloading stuff, books, or tools... |
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Posted:
Mon Oct 30, 2023 4:45 pm
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Joined: 04 Mar 2019
Posts: 1852
Location: Central ND
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Something is very wrong.
I just loaded a Federal with a weighed 26.0 grains of Longshot, SG16 wad with a weighed 1 oz. (437.5 grains) of #8 Lawrence shot and as usual, the Federal hull crimped concave at about .070" crimp depth. I suppose that I could adjust the machine, but my point is that those components fit in the Federal hull easily, too easily. The hull didn't buckle.
That is pretty typical of Longshot, W572 etc, with a SG16 or Z2M16 wad, with 1 oz. of shot in almost any current 2 3/4" 16 gauge hull, except the Remington. |
Last edited by MSM2019 on Tue Oct 31, 2023 5:05 am; edited 1 time in total _________________ Mark...You are entitled to your own opinion. You aren't entitled to your own facts. |
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Posted:
Mon Oct 30, 2023 7:36 pm
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Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 452
Location: WI
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Hmm... Now I'm wondering if I grabbed a couple of the trimmed hulls by mistake. Unfortunately I'm working 1500 miles from home for the week so I can't check.
Would a 1oz load fit a 2-9/16 hull with the other components being the same?
If not, and a 7/8oz load does, then I'd say I probably tried to stuff a 2-3/4 load into a 2-9/16 hull, which would make sense.
It's a MEC Sizemaster with an adjustable charge bar, and the charging is surprisingly accurate especially with the shot - except for flakey powder (like Longshot) which I noticed is a little static-charge sticky with the plastic parts, but it's still usually reasonably consistent. |
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Posted:
Tue Oct 31, 2023 3:06 am
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Member
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
Posts: 2357
Location: West MI
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Beyond confirming exactly what hull length was used when you get back to the bench; what wad seating pressures (if any) are you both applying?
Assuming the intended hull length is confirmed correct and since the 7/8oz fit when the 1oz didn't...could the SG16s solve the 1oz stack height/crimp issue? |
_________________ Sorry, I'm a Duck Hunter so shouldn't be held strictly responsible for my actions between Oct 1st and ice up. |
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Posted:
Tue Oct 31, 2023 5:07 am
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Joined: 04 Mar 2019
Posts: 1852
Location: Central ND
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No, a 1 oz. load generally will not fit well in a 2 9/16" hull. That would be a tight fit. |
_________________ Mark...You are entitled to your own opinion. You aren't entitled to your own facts. |
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Posted:
Wed Nov 01, 2023 10:16 am
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Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 1322
Location: Western WA
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I’ve had very good results with 1 oz in 2 1/2” hulls (Cheddite and Fed) using 800-X and the SG16S wad. However, the MEC crimper requires some careful tuning, and there is some wad compression.
But the velocities are good, and Tom’s pressure numbers came back well within limits. All in all it’s a good fit and its my standard 16ga field load as long as my 800-X holds out.
B. |
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Posted:
Mon Nov 06, 2023 8:39 am
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Joined: 16 Jul 2015
Posts: 2127
Location: Hudson,Wy
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With a 2 1/2" hull and 18 gr. of Longshot, 1 oz. fits real well, except in 2 1/2" Federals. A 2 9/16" Federal would take that load better, but I already trimmed the hulls. Ironically, that load crimps great in a 2 1/2" RGL, but RGL's hold a crimp much better. The load with 18 gr. Longshot is published at about 1,200 fps in a 2 1/2" hull. Interesting how much more powder is called for in a 2 3/4" hull. |
_________________ Only catch snowflakes on your tongue AFTER the birds fly south for the winter... |
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Posted:
Tue Nov 07, 2023 4:09 pm
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Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 452
Location: WI
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They were in fact hulls that were trimmed, so mystery solved - I screwed up.
I have a feeling that 23 grains of longshot in the Federal hull with a 7/8 oz load is going to be too much, even though it's "close". I'm just going to open them up and start over. |
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Posted:
Mon Nov 13, 2023 8:43 pm
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Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 452
Location: WI
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WyoChukar wrote: |
With a 2 1/2" hull and 18 gr. of Longshot, 1 oz. fits real well, except in 2 1/2" Federals. A 2 9/16" Federal would take that load better, but I already trimmed the hulls. Ironically, that load crimps great in a 2 1/2" RGL, but RGL's hold a crimp much better. The load with 18 gr. Longshot is published at about 1,200 fps in a 2 1/2" hull. Interesting how much more powder is called for in a 2 3/4" hull.
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I loaded a couple of the Federals trimmed to 2-9/16 with 18 gr Longshot, 7/8oz no. 8, BPI SG16 wad, and Cheddite primer.
I also loaded a couple of these with the X spreader inserts from BPI, and they also made for a very nice looking load and crimp with the same recipe.
I did try them out, and found them to be quite pleasant to shoot, although a bit dirty which is to be expected for Longshot (from what I've read).
Maybe Santa will bring me a chrono for Christmas... |
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