16ga.com ~ View topic

I made a post on another board (which shall remain nameless). In various responses I was called, among other things, "an unprincipled snob" and a "pathetic wretch", and was told by one respondent that I "couldn't carry his wife's dirty underwear" (I wanted to ask "How big are they?" but restrained myself).

My crime? I stated that some of the people I see at guns shows hovering around the tables of military-styled weapons make me wonder if gun ownership for everyone is a good thing, that I'd just as soon not be associated with them and vice versa, and that I believe such people are the face of gun ownership to much of the general public and therefore are not the best face to put forward.

The point is not that the respondents disagreed with me; many of you may disagree with me as well. The point of this post is that I have never been called names on this board, no matter how much you disagreed with me. For that I thank you.

I've slunk home here to lick my wounds, and to practice my philosophy of never trying to match wits with anyone who's unarmed. I hope this board will always stay as civil as it is, and with the good folks that are here I believe that it will.

Thanks again...

Fin

Member Joined: 28 Oct 2005 Posts: 665 Location: Louisiana

Of course Fin, 16gaugers are gentlemen. This is a 'comfortable' board with what appear to be conscientions, informed, well mannered members.

Member Joined: 15 Mar 2005 Posts: 358 Location: Houston

The great thing, to some people, about an online forum is that you can call people names with impunity. That appeals to many, unfortunately.

At least you're keeping your sense of humor. But since you were already in it up to your chin, you really should have used the "how big are they?" line. That cracked me up.

Member Joined: 09 Oct 2005 Posts: 76 Location: Denver

Yes! You got it Fin – it is a mannerly group that’s why I like it so much. My only problem with this group is they keep me thinking about another shotgun. RevDoc and his bunch have now got me thinking about an older American SxS. These folks are costing me some money…..

Member Joined: 01 Dec 2006 Posts: 524

I think part of the reason 16GA folks are a cut above many others is that the 16GA requires a certain reverence for upland hunting/shotgun history to start with. Reverence often times equals values, fr it is difficult to be passionate about something without it, Whats that saying about show me a man without conviction etc. Tradition, respect, reverence, rights of passage, these are all things that are falling by the way side in popular culture and especially in our big cities. The 16GA site(I theorize) attracts folks that have such a passion for all these things and more, that the same reverence spills over into how we interact with our fellow man/woman. I'm not saying we're necessarily better than everyone else, but generally speaking, I think what i say is true. Otherwise, how else can you possibly account for such a significant body of people being so great. I would hang out here even if I didnt have a 16GA, or a 16GA passion. Because my reverence and respect for people is not predicated on that in and of itself. One thing's for certain, the goodwill, passion and knowledge found here is contagious, before I found this site I wasnt even thinking 16GA. I've since come to my senses though (yeah right) and though I'm without one right now, its on my radar screen as my next purchase. If for no other reason, just to be able to be part of this brotherhood.

Joined: 25 Feb 2006 Posts: 50 Location: john day, or

This group is a breath of fresh air. Glad to see we don't need a 'political' section here.

Sporting guns and bird hunting, with the emphasis on 16s, is all that I need to be completely satisfied.

Member Joined: 26 Apr 2005 Posts: 743

I think the problem, Fin, was the timing of your comment about military weapons--coming as it did on the heels of Zumbo's self-destruction. I think you'll see strange types at most gun shows, but if they're legal firearms owners, and if the guns they own are legal, what the whole Zumbo thing shows is that we'd probably better accept them in silence, whether they're "our" kinds of guns (or people) or not. And here's why: If someone can come and take away your assault rifle, then that same someone can come and take away your fine 16ga double. And the problem is, the people who say they only want to get rid of the assault rifles are liars. They want to get rid of ALL of the guns.

Joined: 03 Jul 2005 Posts: 370 Location: Amarillo, Texas

Yes - I think everyone here tries to disagreee in an agreeable manner and dispute ideas instead of character.

Best,

Mike

Larry,

I don't disagree. We're both from largely ag-based areas where hunting has been, and is still, pretty much an accepted way of life. Still, I know people, and I'll bet you do too, who are not gun haters or anti-hunting but who are made nervous by some of the weapons they see. I'm not saying they're right, but that's the way it is.

For the record, I never advocated banning any gun, and I guess I showed my ignorance by commenting at all because I don't have much knowledge about such weapons. But it's pretty obvious that SOME (a word I should have used in my post but didn't) of the people who are interested in them are interested in them not for their "sporting" attributes, but because they look like the guns they see people shooting it out with in the movies. I think Zumbo used the term "mall ninjas". Those people make me nervous, too.

Maybe education is the answer. I know you're not going to convert any strong anti's, but I don't believe the country is totally polarized on this issue yet. There are still a lot of people on the fence, and the mall ninja image isn't helping. JMHO.

As for the furor over Zumbo's comments, I did see an interesting question posted on another site: How can people be so adamant about supporting the 2nd Amendment and so unwilling to support the 1st?

Fin

Member Joined: 01 Dec 2006 Posts: 524

Without writing an entire editorial on this subject suffice it to say the "times sure have changed". I came up in a small agricultural city in Eastern WA where nobody gave a second thought to seeing us kids driving to hig school in our trucks with guns visible in the back window gunrack. Today if that was done, well.......I can't imagine. There just flat out werent any gun crimes at my school at all...EVER! Back then, I don't even remember anyone having the desire for, or owning an assault, or military type rifle except maybe an M-1 or some such. Guns were used for one thing back then in my town - hunting, or practicing to hunt. When the hunting seasons came around the whole town literally went hunting. How we went from that to where we are today is unbelievable. And, i'm not talking very long ago, I graduated from high School in 1977. Now you all may wonder why I illustrate this, or how this correlates with this whole subject. Well, thats just it....it doesnt!
Back then, it was irrelevant because as I stated, nobody had, or desired those guns where I lived. Guess its kind of simialr to the modern police equipment...they had to update fire power to be able to deal with the modern criminals/gangs and are now issued assault, or at least pistols.
So, it figures now that common folks have also felt the need to update their arsenals too.

Joined: 03 Jul 2005 Posts: 370 Location: Amarillo, Texas

Fin wrote:

"How can people be so adamant about supporting the 2nd Amendment and so unwilling to support the 1st?"

Both amendments are about government infringing on the right. A white supremist has the right to say anything he wants. He can be fired for saying it on TV in a company uniform while standing in front of a company truck by the company he works for without violating the 1st amendment.

Mike

Fin,

I need to apologise to you, because I seem to have started everything. I hadn't heard or seen jim Zumbo's comments, and was curious. After I read what had been said, I remembered an incident, a few days earlier where, on a preserve, I witnessed a camo clad gunner (complete with face paint) empty a five round semi-auto at every bird that flew, and a few that didn't. Later, I overheard that fellow threaten to shoot the guides dog. I was on the next hill, helping train a buddies dog, and we just felt the need to get outta there.

So, even though I own, what could be described as a an assault weapon, or four, (Semi auto shotgun with plastic stock, AR-15, Mini 14, and 10-22, with butler Creek stock) I tended to take Mr. Zumbo's side. I commented more based on recent memory, and less from what I know to be right for our sport.

However, if we don't join together, as gunners and hunters, and police ourselves, and the slobs among us, we seem destined to be doomed. And we need to distinguish the slob by his actions, not by the color of his gun stock.

Again Fin, I'm truly sorry to have dragged you into this.

PGG,

Nah; no apology necessary. I know better than to post over there; the guys who jumped me (us) aren't really interested in discussing anything, they just want to goad people who ought to know better into posting an opinion different than the lock-step one they espouse so they can exhibit their intellectual and "moral" superiority. I've stepped in it there a couple times before, and have regretted every one of them. I'll learn (maybe).

I'll never understand the need to denigrate personally someone with whom you disagree. That to me is an indicator of a small mind, and there isn't enough brain power among those guys to spell c-a-t.

Mike, you're right from a consitiutional standpoint; I just thought it interesting that people so concerned about one right didn't support one of "our own" exercising another.

I did want to say to Doug: I've been one of the people decrying "political" posts here, and then I went and started one. So Doug, if you want to make this thread go away, OK by me.

Fin

Member Joined: 17 Feb 2007 Posts: 497

I enjoy owning and shooting a wide variety of Firearms, and make no apologies for doing so.

I like 16 Gauges, SxS, O/Us, Pumps, and Semis, I also enjoy Kalashnikovs. I don't hunt with them, but I enjoy collecting, building them, and shooting them.

IMHO Zumbo, crapped in his mess kit, as much as called me a terrorist Evil or Very Mad

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