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I have always read that 1 oz load was ideal for 16 ga. In fact one author went so far as to state that "a 1 oz load in a 16 ga is equal to a 1 1/4 oz load in a 12. I see on this board and others that some 16 ga hunters are using 1 1/8 oz loads--- Any advantages (shot string etc..)? Comments most welcome on all loads.
Cheers, John

I can't tell much difference between the two shot loads you mention when I am hunting pheasants and using #6 shot. Both are effective when I point the gun right. I can see a possible advantage for the heavier load with larger shot sizes however, so that more pellets are available to make the pattern a little thicker. I think both of these loads are right in the zone where a 16 gauge works well. Smile

Member Joined: 09 Dec 2005 Posts: 989 Location: Las Vegas

As a holder of a high school degree I'd like to chime in here. It's my studied opinion that the 1 1/8 oz. load is heavier than the 1 oz. load. Ballistically, this would equate to the 1 1/8 oz. load weighing more than the 1 oz. load, therefore, making these loads un-equal, proportionately speaking. Of course, this assumes, a constant temperature and altitude for both loads. Your milage may vary.

Matt

Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 787 Location: Indiana

As most of you know, this is a subject we've beaten to death on past threads and personally, having used 1 oz. loads in both the 20 and 16 gauges in shot sizes #5 and #6 to kill roosters, with both IC and Mod chokes, I know the 1 oz load will kill them as dead as anything else going IF:
--ranges are reasonable (not much over 40 yards; many, many birds are killed at half that range)

--choke is sufficient (at least IC; I'm talking wild birds here, not preserve birds one can kill with a skeet gun)

--the bird is hit adequately somewhere in the front end (I'd hate to try an ass-end shot at 40 yards with a 1 oz. load; the bird deserves better)

--the load is a good one, not the cheapest promo load one can buy

AND having said all of the above, I'd still want a good bird dog, wise in the way of roosters, to take with me as insurance--no matter WHAT load I was using......ONLY 20 more days to go, boys and the seasons's OPEN !!!

Member Joined: 02 Oct 2007 Posts: 1975

I am using 7/8 oz 5 1/2 nickle plated shot with 17 grains od clay powder which is about 1300 fps and I have no trouble knocking down pheasants. Had a crossing shot today of about 40 yards and the bird came back dead. Went to the local preserve today and came home with 9 extra scratch birds. The freezers are full. I'm just lucky when I shoot though.

The one aspect almost always overlooked in these comparisons is bore diameter and its effect on the amount and the size of the pellets passing through it. A 12 bore will always handle bigger shot and more of it better than any smaller bore. A 16 will outperform any 20 ga for the same reason.

Some 20 ga guns will handle #5 shot okay. Some do not. #5 shot is marginal in the 20. I-1/8 ounce of #5 shot is about minimum to ensure enough pattern density to reliably kill pheasant size birds at the far end of reasonable ranges. However, a 1-1/8 ounce load of #5 shot is too much for a 20 to handle well with few exceptions. A 1 ounce load of #5 shot is okay if ranges are held to 30 yards max. However, at these distances, a one ounce load of #6 shot will do just fine. It will pattern better at higher velocities from a 20, and could be a bit more effective at slightly longer ranges as well.

The 16 will handle a 1-1/8 ounce load of #5 shot far better than any 20. It will also pattern the load better at higher velocities. This can be critical at forty yards to ensure adequate penatration on a good sized pheasant.

There is no getting around bore size. It pretty much dictates smooth bore ballistics more than any other factor. That is why a 16 ga in a trim light package will always outpreform the 20 in the game fields. A light 12 will always outperform a 16. However, lightly built 12 gauges that balance and handle as well as a well designed 16 are very few and far between. They are also usually much more expensive to buy. They can also be somewhat fragile due to the weight trimming needed. To me, a well designed, strong, but light 16 can be had at a much better price and is the answer to an upland hunter's needs hands down.

Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 787 Location: Indiana

To repeat: I've shot a good number(4 or 5 dozen) wild roosters in Indiana and Iowa with a 20 gauge with 1 oz. #5 and #6's and the gauge/load drops squarely hit birds just fine. Hit them poorly with a 20, 16, 12 and whatever load and they're still likely to be lost....

I've been using 2 different types of shells on thunder chickens this fall:

- Winchester Super X Factory loads - 1-1/8 ounce of #7.5
- Reloaded RGL's with 1 ounce of #7

Me and the old dog have gotten almost 50 grouse so far (plus a dozen or so timber doodles) and the 1 ounce loads knock them down just as well as the 1-1/8 loads do...and they're much cheaper. I/C in the bottom (first) tube and Mod. in the top(second).

A one ounce load of #7.5 is usually more than enough on most ruffs. A one ounce #7 shot is even better, especially once the birds' late season plumage fills out. Both the 20 and the 16 handle these two loads just fine. I've found a 3/4 ounce load of #7.5 shot from a 28 is usually enough for most grouse. I also handload a 7/8 ounce, 28 gauge load that is pure poison on them. However, pheasant are a bigger, tougher bird than ruffs. A bigger pellet provides enough energy and penetration to ensure clean pheasant kills in my experience. Bigger pellets mean heavier loads to ensure adequate pattern densities at any reasonable range

Sure, a spot on load of 7.5 shot in the head will dump any pheasant that ever lived, but such fine shooting is usually not always possible in the field. We would all like to think we are that good, but it just ain't so for most of us. We tend to take the shots presented to us and do the best we can. Choosing the right pellet size will usually give us the needed insurance to dump them clean at any reasonable distance from any angle including the all too frequent straight going away shot.

Guest

Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 787 Location: Indiana

Amen; I agree, MGF...clays are the place to use the cheap loads; the birds deserve our best...

1 0z. 6's in the right barrel, 1 1/8 oz. 5's in the left. Isn't that one of the main advantages to shooting a double to begin with?

I wish I could say every going away pheasant I shot with 7.5's inside 30 yards went down clean and quick. Taint so Magee. Too many kept right on going, loose tail feathers and all. If I was able to, a follow up load of 6's usually did the trick. If not, the dog would usually find the bird after a diligent search ( and unecessarily wasted time to boot), and in most cases, it would be sick enough not to put up much of a fight. Even so, some have still been lost to suffer a lingering death.

I've never felt right about such a scenario. I'm far from squeemish, but I prefer that the bird be brought back stone dead rather than roughed up and needing its neck snapped. It still happens occasionally even with enough pellet size like #6 through #4, but it happens far less. And on top of that, quite rightly, #7.5 shot leaves too much lead in the meat. Best to use enough pellet size for the job at hand and to help ensure good table fare. Just my take on it based on my experience.

Guest

Well, we have different experiences. Although I've gone to 6s in the first tube for better penetration and less shot in the meat, I've killed a lot of pheasants over the Lews with fast, premium 7.5s w/o long chases and the like.

We hunt with two Lews and a golden, and we've never left many crips in the field. Except on really difficult-condition days, I'd bet most of our first shots are easily within 30.We're not shy about walking a lot and working for good shots. Or maybe the Lews have just spoiled us. Don't really know. All I know in my case is that a lot practice and hunting over good dogs seems to add up. My brother, if he really is my brother, doesn't even need to practice much. God blessed him with natural ability, including good eyes and fast hands. I have to work on my wingshoointg during the off-season to stay on par with him.

I'll probably stay with the Rem Express 1 1/8 6s in the bottom and the Federal Premium 1 1/4 oz 6s from the top, choked IC/Mod, from my FAIR 600 or 900, both 16s. A very efficient combo last year through the 900, and perfect today with the 600 on our first outing. Well, not perfect. No misses, but my second rooster needed the second barrel for a firm plant.

Dogs were tremendous today; they handled very well when they needed to be handled at all (the youngster has some wheels and needs to be whistled in every now and then.) They're all asleep now, and that's where I'm headed, too. Can't beat a good day in the field with the family.

Member Joined: 06 Oct 2007 Posts: 2350 Location: West MI

just an FYI on some factory loads, 16ga of course;

For MI & OH put & take-Pheasant and Chuckers, wild-Grouse, Woodies & Bunnies I send a hand rolled spreader load of #7 out the 1st tube then a factory 1 1/8oz #6 follow-up. Some home work on a couple of factory loads opened my eyes a bit. Looking just at the Average Shot Weight of 6 random shells from each box, take a look;

Rem Xpress LR 1295fps 1 1/8oz #6; 492.5g, 491, 484, 492, 486.5 & 492=489.66g (1.12oz) ASW, not bad, what was bought.

Win HB 3 1/4 DE (1295fps) 1 1/8 #6; 471.5g, 481,478, 467, 466.5, & 470.5=472.42 (1.08oz) ASW, not what was paid for. For grins the wad (Gualandi/BP SG16) weighed an average 29g. Added to the ASW = just over 1 1/8oz HMMM?!!

No idea of true speed.

Watch those Win HB 1 1/8oz shells. Since the Rem's are $12+ it justifies hand rolling my follow up shot. The cost is a wash and there is no ? of whats on its way to the bird.

Thanks for all the great 16gz reload info.