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Joined: 24 Nov 2007 Posts: 1 Location: central pa

I'm looking to buy a new shotgun, I've been looking at the sx3 and checking out the o/u. I enjoy shooting the 16 ga, i use the 16 for grouse and pheasant but i was wondering if the 16 is big enough for duck and geese.

DB.

As an all around waterfowl gun, from pass shooting to hard weather days, no. But for decoying ducks and geese, sure.

Member Joined: 08 Nov 2005 Posts: 3438 Location: Illinois

With Bismuth or any of the premium line of shells the 16 will respond well within reasonable limits---without the punishing recoil.Even a 3 1/2 in 10 ga is limited in it's skybusting ability at extreme ranges Wink

I am glad you brought this up.....
I was going to post some thoughts about the 16 ga and waterfowling. I just returned home from a two day opener and once again I simply amaze myself.
First, I know there are purists who say stuffing an 1.25 oz of shot thru a 16 is too much and they are probably right. But when you have divers going mach 9 in a 10 knot cross wind over your dekes at 40 yards you need every pellet you can get. So for my number one load for waterfowling it is the Kent TM 1.25oz of #5's. I realize this scenario is probably 12 gauge material but when you shoot a sweet sixteen as good as I do, why switch? Every year my buddy insists I move up to a 12 ga. yet I consistently out shoot him with his 3.5" 12 gauge and his monster 1 3/4 oz loads.
Secondly, for close in woody holes and decoying puddle ducks my choice is the Bismuth 1 oz. of #4's. I could probably go with #6's just for pellet count but the larger pellet helps terminate them quickly. No crips.
Lastly, for swatter loads the Remington #2 steel does an outstanding job. However, for anything else... well to put it nicely, I'll pass. Next?
just one more note........I just love my Browning sweet sixteen with a modified tru lock extended choke. It is devastating. I realize it is old technology but you if you are a bird hunter you have to shoot what works for you not what looks good. I 've been there and done that or bought that and that is why I no longer own Spanish SxS's or Italian O/U's. Do yourself a favor and buy what you can shoot!!!

Joined: 15 Oct 2004 Posts: 787 Location: Indiana

UncleDanFan summed it up nicely. I agree 100% with what he said; the 16 is a fine gun for jumpshooting ducks and over decoys like I do here in Indiana---but an all-weather, rough-and -tumble heavy duty duck gun (as in gunning for So. Illinois geese or South Dakota ducks and geese of all sizes and descriptions, long range pass shooting with non-toxics, etc) requires a bit more punch and range than the 16 can muster...give me a 12 gauge Winchester Heavy Duck Model 12 or 21, a Browning A-5 Mag or a Super Black Eagle for those chores---the big birds deserve no less....

Member Joined: 09 Dec 2005 Posts: 989 Location: Las Vegas

pbr: Interesting. I'm assuming you're using the Japanese version of the S16 with the Invector choke system? Isn't the 1 1/4 oz. load a little tough on the forearm?

Matt

Guest

I'm a fly fisherman and I get really irritated when I see someone "plays" a fish for over 15 minutes. You either get the fish in or let it break you off but when you "play" a fish over that time, the lactic acid builds up in and even when you let it go, the fish willl probably die.

When someone wants to use a certain gauge to be more "sporting", I feel the same way. The 16 gauge is a fine upland and possible "pothole" gun over decoyed birds but not a serious waterfowl gun for shots taken over 35 yard gun. You can shoot TM for your waterfowl but TM goes goes for around $1.50/round. I can't and don't want to shoot TM in my 16 for my waterfowl. I rather shoot a quality Kent 12 gauge steel load @ 1500 fps in a 1 1/8 oz 3" shell for less than $.60/round. Since steel is 82% the density of lead, this is the one time that having a high velocity load does make a difference. The reason why your friend's 12 gauge 3 1/3" isn't dropping birds is because he is shooting too slow of a load. He needs to go to a lighter payload with a faster speed to get better results. I know of a goose guide in Washington state that shoots a 20 gauge hevi shot loads to cover the "getaway" honkers of his clients. He has been shooting a long time and can hit a honker in the head @ 40 yards but he makes his living doing that. I know what works for me and the 12 gauge is just better medicine for someone who doesn't earn their keep by guiding clients.

I have used the 16 with bismuth 2's for geese, and it works very well within 35 yds or so, but it's not my first choice. With the TM #5's, the 16 is a very good duck gun, and with those loads (only) it compares well with a 12 IMHO. Steel 16's are loaded too slow by the factories to suit me.
Here's a pic of me with my Merkel 16ga. and 7 Canadas and 2 Mallards taken one morning in Nov.06 with the above loads...and 12 shots if I remember correctly. But normally I use a 12ga. when I'm not just foolin' around!

Guest

My hunting buddy makes a yearly trek to Canada in October to get his "goose fix". According to him, you guys in Canada are lucky to get uneducated birds with little pressure. He even told me that on good days in Canada that you don't even have to shoot your guns. You just let them land and everyone takes turns running down their birds!!! That's why the Native People used to make "throwing sticks" out of a rock tied to the end of a stick. A 12" stick went faster than an 16" stick, hence it was determined than a 12 is always better than a 16.......

Tall tale for the day...

Matt,
I have had no problems with the forearm and yes it is the Japanese version. I also had the gun dipped by Duracoat in max 4. Is that sacrilege having it dipped?

Ted

Member Joined: 31 Oct 2005 Posts: 446 Location: Wisconsin

The Mid-Western Giant Canada is a big bird and needs all the help it can get to down it. I LIKE the 16 gauge and even have a few but never use it for geese. Once in awhile I will take a 16 for jump shooting ducks while walking a creek but with the demise of Bismuth and the ever increasing price and increasing scarcity of Kent TM, that will only be for a few more years.
I use Hevi-Shot in 12 gauge 3" Rem 332 and if the waether is really crappy, a Rem 870.-Dick

Member Joined: 09 Dec 2005 Posts: 989 Location: Las Vegas

pbr: No sacrlege as far as I'm concerned. Now if it were a Belgium gun..... Shocked

Back in the days when you could use lead I did all my duck hunting with my Sweet cause it was the only gun I had. I rolled my own 1 1/4oz., "baby magnums" of #5 shot. Worked great. I did split my forearm but had it fixed years ago.

Matt

Tangentally, another casualty of the demise of bismuth is that it is now hard to justify the purchase of an older sxs duck gun. I've been wanting to get a nice Lefever damascus 12b for ducks over dekes using low pressure bismuth loads, but now, I guess I'll just stick to my bps 12. I don't enjoy pumps as much as sxs's, but you use what you have, and that gun has dropped many hundreds of waterfowl for me. I wonder if TM will ever be available to reload?

[img]

Here is the sweet sixteen in max 4. Boat is a MLB Zack Taylor. Judging by the photo I would say the 16 is big enough.[/img]

PBR, did you know pbr is the official beer of Portland, OR?

Great pic! That is a helluva boat too. Does the motor sticking up make it hard to use it as a layout boat or do the birds not care? I've been thinking of getting or making a small 9-10' sneak boat that is rowable, like a devlin scaup. Hunting in a small grassed boat with handmade decoys and a classic sxs would be the shangrila of duck hunting experiences to me.