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| < 16ga. Ammunition & Reloading ~ Anyone have experience with Claybuster or Rem Wads... |
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 Posted:
Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:31 pm
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Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 1310
Location: Western WA
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...in Fiocchi hulls?
Thanks,
Brewster |
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| Posted:
Tue Jun 02, 2009 8:18 pm
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Member
Joined: 02 Jun 2009
Posts: 10
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| I have tried to use that combo without any luck so far. My reloader may need further adjustment but the 1-1/8 oz SP16 wads don't crimp right. |
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Browning Citori Lightning 16ga, Remington 1100 EC 16ga |
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| Posted:
Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:59 pm
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Joined: 07 Oct 2008
Posts: 74
Location: MO Ozarks
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I loaded 100 rounds as follows
16 ga. Fio blue hull
Fio 616 primer
16.8 gr. Unique
CB 16 ga. wad
7/8 oz. shot w/ 2 cheerios for filler in the bottom of wad
Crimped and shot great and have been reload to same spec. |
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BCP
"Life is tough, but it's tougher if your stupid." - John Wayne |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:22 am
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Member
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 6535
Location: massachusetts
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I've used the SP16 wad in both Fiocchi and cheddite type hulls (little to no difference) for heavy shot loads of 1-1/8 and 1-1/4 ounces. They work just fine.
I like to blooper proof these loads as well. I strongly suggest placing a 1-1/4 inch square patch of polyethylene plastic cut from a stout food storage bag under the SP16 wad before seating it to act as a powder seal in any hunting load packed into these roomier hulls. The average hunting load gets handled and carried in a pocket far more than a target round. The patch prevents any possible powder migration from happening. The patch will simply get blown out of the barrel along with the one piece wad. I've never had a properly centered and seated one lodge in the barrel. It will not significantly affect pressure either, but will insure a full strength load when it's needed.
I'd suggest using the same patch with the CB wads as well. It's good insurance. |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 8:46 am
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Joined: 23 Jan 2008
Posts: 224
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| Quote: |
| It will not significantly affect pressure either, but will insure a full strength load when it's needed.
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16gg, I tested the little plastic sheets on my last batch of loads sent to Tom Armbrust. I made one load with the plastic you suggest, and an identical load without the plastic.
The results: the little plastic sheet you suggest raised pressure about 2000 to 2500 psi. I don't have my numbers infront of me, so that is an estimate. I can provide the exact data if needed. I would consider this a significant increase in pressure.
On the up side, the loads with the plastic sheet were much more consistent. |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:11 am
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Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 428
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I just loaded a couple of boxes of 16's with the new "blue" Claybuster 1oz. wad, the Remington "black" game load hulls and 19.7 Grains of Universal Clays powder. They look great, but I have not had a chance to pattern or chronograph them yet.
I loaded them on a brand new P&W 375C Duromatic that I purchsed solely for the 16! I bought it after many years of loading my skeet .410's on the same type loader (375 Duromatic).
If they shoot as good as they look, I will be in high cotton!  |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:12 am
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Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 1310
Location: Western WA
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| Do the CB wads hold a full ounce of lead? |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:16 am
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Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 428
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| Brewster11 wrote: |
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Do the CB wads hold a full ounce of lead?
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Good question! It holds all that my P&W 1 oz. bushing will drop! I ass/u/me that P&W's bushings are accurate! I did not however weigh the shot. 
I hope it's dropping an ounce because I would hate to change now that I bought 5,000 wads. Besides, the blue wads are awful pretty  |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:22 am
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Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 428
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I think I'm gonna hang some of them on the Christmas tree this year!  |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 11:29 am
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Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 428
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Brewster11,
Is your concern from one of the other posts about the lead rising above the shot cup? If it is, I don't recall seeing this happen, but would be happy to load a few more tonight paying particular attention to the shot level vs. cup height and let you know tomorrow!  |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:21 pm
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Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 1310
Location: Western WA
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KolarDan,
Yes, I would like the shot to be completely contained in the cup. That would be very useful information, thanks.
Brewster |
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| Posted:
Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:03 pm
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Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 428
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I will let you know tomorrow.  |
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| Posted:
Thu Jun 04, 2009 5:04 am
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Joined: 20 Mar 2009
Posts: 428
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Brewster11,
I loaded another box of 16's last night and am happy to report that the 1 oz. of #9 shot fills the CB wad to the top without rising above the shot cup. I load a lot of shells for skeet, I mean a lot of shells and I have never loaded a shell that looks any better than these 16's with the black Rem. hull, Universal Clays Powder and the new Claybuster 1oz. wad.
I load all my shotshell ammo on P&W presses;
P&W 375C Duromatic for 16 Ga.
P&W 900 Elite for 20 Ga.
P&W Platinum 200 for 28 Ga.
P&W 375 Duromatic for .410 Ga.
Hope this info. helps you out.
In case you are wondering, I do not load 12 Ga. at all. |
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| Posted:
Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:51 am
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Joined: 08 Feb 2009
Posts: 1310
Location: Western WA
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KolarDan,
Thanks for the info, I will give the CB a try in Fiocchi hulls.
Let us know how your loads pattern and shoot.
Brewster |
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| Posted:
Thu Jun 04, 2009 11:00 am
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Member
Joined: 12 Mar 2005
Posts: 6535
Location: massachusetts
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| bowbuilder wrote: |
| Quote: |
| It will not significantly affect pressure either, but will insure a full strength load when it's needed.
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16gg, I tested the little plastic sheets on my last batch of loads sent to Tom Armbrust. I made one load with the plastic you suggest, and an identical load without the plastic.
The results: the little plastic sheet you suggest raised pressure about 2000 to 2500 psi. I don't have my numbers infront of me, so that is an estimate. I can provide the exact data if needed. I would consider this a significant increase in pressure.
On the up side, the loads with the plastic sheet were much more consistent.
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I'm betting the higher pressures and better consistancy were the results of the patch doing its job. If the load you sent was subjected to the ususal rough handling any mailed package gets, you can bet your bippy there was some powder migration happening in the unpatched loads. the SP16 wad is not an ideal fit in these roomier hulls.
I'd like to know what your load was and what the expected (previously tested and established) velocities and pressures were as opposed to what they did with the patch. You failed to note whether the pressures of the patched loads were unsafe or not. That would be important to know.
I had some of my patched loads tested years ago in a known 12 ga hunting load using cheddite type hulls and the old yellow WW12AA F 1-1/4 ounce wads over Unique. The wad fit had the same problem, but the patterns and breaks I got with unpatched loads showed real promise except for an occasional blooper.
My patched loads stayed well within the safe pressure levels the load was designed to get. Yes, the results were a bit higher by about 500 to 750 PSI on average, but the original designed pressures were moderate to begin with. The results in pressures and velocity were also more uniform with the patch.
I would not recommend any change in any near max to max pressure load like adding a plastic patch. Common sense should rule it out. I'd also not recommend adding the patch into a newly designed load with unknown pressures and then shooting it in a standard shotgun either--even a seemingly mild one. It is always wise to have the expected pressures already established before making any change.
I have been using these patches in my heavy 1-1/4 ounce Blue Dot powered loads. The pressures without the patch are at 9.1K in mine. Even adding a 2K more will not redline the load. However, Blue Dot is a slow burning shotgun powder, and the patterns I'm getting indicate the pressures are not going anywhwere near 11.1K.
Loads with faster burning powders would probably reach higher relative pressures. However, most heavier hunting loads in subgauges like the 16 do not use fast burning powders. If anyone is using a fast powder like Red Dot or Green Dot in their heavie 16 ga hunting loads, they are probably already at or near the pressure limits. So adding a patch under the wad would be unwise. Again, common sense is required here.
Common sense is required for all reloading. However, If I neglected to add the above warning, then I'm remiss for not doing so. DON'T EVER DO THAT. Even so, for moderate pressure hunting loads of around 9 to 9.5K PSI using moderate to slow powders, it is very doubtful the patch will not put the load in the red zone as far as my experiences indicate. |
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